1. Post #1921
    Gold Member
    cdr248's Avatar
    August 2009
    15,075 Posts
    Kinda didn't like Fallout 4's shooting tbh
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  2. Post #1922
    Gold Member
    The Jack's Avatar
    August 2011
    4,901 Posts
    I think an issue I'd have with Mordau/Chivalry combat, even though it's a flat improvement and I'd be stupid to say no to it in place of what we already have, is that you'd need to account for the super-human abilities of fighters in tes.

    I mean naked guys who use just their fists can contend with demons, dragons, lightning spewing mages, and knights wearing magical full-plate. It's a universe where getting stabbed in the gut a few times is somewhat survivable if you've hardened your body with training. But it's also a universe with mythical materials, IE I should be able to cut through well made steel plate with a scimitar if I've got monster strength and the weapon made of something harder than steel.


    I think you could work towards some 'realistic' portrayal of these fantasy elements (Not real, but believable within the game's own universe) and that'd be what I'd most want Bethesda to do.



    Also Fo4's shooting wouldn't make it in a shooting game. It's only 'good' in that it's better than the garbage we've had before, and shooting isn't the game's primary feature.
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  3. Post #1923
    Gold Member
    Jmir 54's Avatar
    October 2008
    5,358 Posts
    Kinda didn't like Fallout 4's shooting tbh
    The shooting was the best part imo. Shooting individual limbs off of synths and ghouls was my favorite thing to do in that game
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  4. Post #1924
    Gold Member
    Destroyox's Avatar
    June 2012
    6,354 Posts
    I think an issue I'd have with Mordau/Chivalry combat, even though it's a flat improvement and I'd be stupid to say no to it in place of what we already have, is that you'd need to account for the super-human abilities of fighters in tes.

    I mean naked guys who use just their fists can contend with demons, dragons, lightning spewing mages, and knights wearing magical full-plate. It's a universe where getting stabbed in the gut a few times is somewhat survivable if you've hardened your body with training. But it's also a universe with mythical materials, IE I should be able to cut through well made steel plate with a scimitar if I've got monster strength and the weapon made of something harder than steel.


    I think you could work towards some 'realistic' portrayal of these fantasy elements (Not real, but believable within the game's own universe) and that'd be what I'd most want Bethesda to do.
    I don't see how those combat systems limit that. You could easily make perks allowing you to blocking or attacking faster.

  5. Post #1925
    Gold Member
    MrHeadHopper's Avatar
    July 2009
    4,470 Posts
    I don't see how those combat systems limit that. You could easily make perks allowing you to blocking or attacking faster.
    It wouldn't fit as it is, is the problem, and it wouldn't fit without some major alterations to the point where it might be better to just keep developing the formula that Skyrim had. It's a good one.

    Skyrim's combat is better than Oblivion's. Oblivion didn't have shield-bashing. Morrowind's was dice-rolling with the illusion of realtime, which isn't to my tastes, sorry to say. So we're on an upward trend. TES 6 is going to really set the tone for the company, I feel. Whether it's a big improvement, a retread, or a mix of improvements and downgrades like Fallout 4 was. What they bring next is going to show how they react to the fanbase's discussion and how they react to their relatively recent mainstream exposure.
    Oblivion did have shield bashing, but you needed like 100 skill in Block and it triggered randomly and automatically. Which was completely cancerous.

    I just can't understand why anyone would ever like Morrowind's combat. I don't wanna say immersion breaking but the first time I attacked a man and my sword literally clipped into his model and nothing happened it honestly felt like I'd bugged the game out, like this wasn't how it was meant to be. Wrong.

    It was fun though, to break the game because of how lax the ruleset was. Stealing stuff from the big fancy Temple that was worth 3000 gold and selling it to get mad gear and training was pretty fun.

    Though one thing that is strictly better that I wish they'd bring back for TESVI was how enchanted weapons were handled. They auto recharged! Like holy shit, I've never used a enchanted weapon in either Oblivion or Skyrim because of how ridiculously annoying it is to constantly recharge it.
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  6. Post #1926
    jonu67's Avatar
    September 2012
    4,076 Posts
    Skyrim's combat is better than Oblivion's. Oblivion didn't have shield-bashing. Morrowind's was dice-rolling with the illusion of realtime, which isn't to my tastes, sorry to say. So we're on an upward trend. TES 6 is going to really set the tone for the company, I feel. Whether it's a big improvement, a retread, or a mix of improvements and downgrades like Fallout 4 was. What they bring next is going to show how they react to the fanbase's discussion and how they react to their relatively recent mainstream exposure.
    It's hilarious how many times I've gone to shield bash in oblivion while recently replaying it after years of Skyrim.

    And while I'll admit Skyrim's combat is more refined, (Still not great, but better) something I felt was better in Oblivion over Skyrim as a shield user was the one button for magic, I hope they allow for both options, hand held spells AND the one button for spells in the Elder Scrolls 6.
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  7. Post #1927
    Gold Member
    fulgrim's Avatar
    November 2009
    2,716 Posts
    All I remember about Oblivion's combat is hours of stealth archery, only stopping occasionally to have a go at wading through whole groups of bad guys, flailing a wonderfully weightless feeling two handed weapon around and sending the lot of them flying through the air.

  8. Post #1928
    :-)
    Phycosymo's Avatar
    December 2007
    5,014 Posts
    Kinda didn't like Fallout 4's shooting tbh
    Shooting was the only thing that was good about FO4. Skyrim at least has some better world building and the game gets more fun when you get to a higher level.
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  9. Post #1929
    jonu67's Avatar
    September 2012
    4,076 Posts
    All I remember about Oblivion's combat is hours of stealth archery, only stopping occasionally to have a go at wading through whole groups of bad guys, flailing a wonderfully weightless feeling two handed weapon around and sending the lot of them flying through the air.
    For me it was getting enough money to create a spell that can basically kill anything in one hit mixed with a spell that had a wide range that did the same thing.

    And you know, that's what's so sad about Skyrim tbh, it got marginally better sword play sure, but all of the other playstyles suffered for it, being a mage is boring and it doesn't scale well later on and being a ranger is exactly the same, but the enchantment system sucks now too so it's "technically" worse, no enchanted arrows either.

    While Skyrims combat feels better, Oblivion's combat had far more depth to it, hopefully in Elder Scrolls 6 we can get better feeling combat AND more depth in the various systems.
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  10. Post #1930
    27X
    Rantasaurus Rex
    27X's Avatar
    July 2010
    12,227 Posts
    They should be taking notes from Dargon's Dargma, because that's a pretty amazing system that is both simple and has nice depth and growth range, but the fact is a company as insulated as Bethesda simply isn't open to that level of change and implementation, especially when they sell tens of millions of copies with things as they are.

  11. Post #1931
    Gold Member
    DiscoInferno's Avatar
    November 2008
    15,422 Posts
    One thing Gradon's Godma had over Skyrim if we want a one-to-one comparison is with dragon antagonists. Grigori is by far more intimidating and interesting than Alduin. Any Top 10 List of dergans that put Aludin over Grigori (if they even list Grigori at all) are wrong and either pandering or ignorant.
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  12. Post #1932
    jimbobjoe1234's Avatar
    August 2012
    4,225 Posts
    Wish we could chop limbs off of draugr. Would make them more interesting.

  13. Post #1933
    Gold Member
    RikohZX's Avatar
    September 2009
    15,719 Posts
    Imagine a TES game with this kind of combat
    Probably impossible on Gamebryo though.
    Just more dynamic animations with proper hitboxes, and being able to counter, parry and block physical attacks with your own would be pretty cool. Although your attacks in Skyrim are directionally influenced it's just a bland sweep left or right, and all one/two-handed weapon defense comes down to just holding it infront of you to block things in that direction.
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  14. Post #1934
    GLH
    GLH's Avatar
    July 2011
    950 Posts
    ~
    Is there any way to steal a NPC's face? I saw one that looks like would be a decent template to start from and edit for another playthrough.
    ~
    If you use Racemenu (or Chargen Extension, which is included in Racemenu), you can import .nif files. I think you can any NPC's .nif file using the Creation Kit, though.
    Try opening the specific NPC in the CC and see if there is a .nif export somewhere.
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  15. Post #1935
    Gold Member
    The Jack's Avatar
    August 2011
    4,901 Posts
    Oh no question, Alduin was a shit villain. I don't even know of this grigori and I can wager he's more interesting.

    Draugr are a pretty crap enemy too.
    They were quite different in morrowind. It's a disapointment that there's no variety of draugr in skyrim, like different magics in the same corpses. Or maybe just that they weren't any different from the skeleton warriors we usually get (whilst we lack the different ranks of skeleton warriors)

    That one section of the game where we fight.. I think they were called hungry shades. Black floating skeletons with red eyes. That was an interesting deviation.

    But skyrim missed out on so many of the common/easy to implement enemies. Ghosts for example became exclusively fucking people with effects on them and wraiths are gone. Scamps and goblins were missing from the game even though falmer are so close to what you'd expect.

    TES will always upset me as this series that has so much potential that'll never get realised with bethesda operating the way they do.
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  16. Post #1936
    Gold Member
    MrHeadHopper's Avatar
    July 2009
    4,470 Posts
    If you use Racemenu (or Chargen Extension, which is included in Racemenu), you can import .nif files. I think you can any NPC's .nif file using the Creation Kit, though.
    Try opening the specific NPC in the CC and see if there is a .nif export somewhere.
    I've done that for other characters, but this particular one doesn't seem to have any facegen files. Just tri files. Is it possible it's using just these .tri files to generate it's unique face? The only solution I can think of if that's the case is getting them to be playable so I can pull up showracemenu and export their head as a standalone .nif, but I dunno how I'd do that.

    Oh no question, Alduin was a shit villain. I don't even know of this grigori and I can wager he's more interesting.

    Draugr are a pretty crap enemy too.
    They were quite different in morrowind. It's a disapointment that there's no variety of draugr in skyrim, like different magics in the same corpses. Or maybe just that they weren't any different from the skeleton warriors we usually get (whilst we lack the different ranks of skeleton warriors)

    That one section of the game where we fight.. I think they were called hungry shades. Black floating skeletons with red eyes. That was an interesting deviation.

    But skyrim missed out on so many of the common/easy to implement enemies. Ghosts for example became exclusively fucking people with effects on them and wraiths are gone. Scamps and goblins were missing from the game even though falmer are so close to what you'd expect.

    TES will always upset me as this series that has so much potential that'll never get realised with bethesda operating the way they do.
    Morrowind's enemies were indeed pretty unique and interesting, which made Oblivion all the more troubling. Oblivion enemy design made me feel like I'm playing the idea of a generic fantasy RPG condensated into one game. Scamps were pretty much elongated Imps from World of Warcraft ffs.

    I agree with you on ghosts not being spookier aesthetically, but they were humanized because they gained a voice set. Why is the Falmer not being generic goblins bad? They have a unique background and design elements. Is that not good?

    If you want generic fantasy things, just get Immersive Creatures. It's got everything you want and more.
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  17. Post #1937
    Gold Member
    Samiam22's Avatar
    January 2008
    9,611 Posts
    Bought Morrowind during the sale, gonna try it out tonight.
    Good choice, it's actually the best one. The mechanics are really dated, but it doesn't stop that from being really amazing still. If you get stuck with something early on, tell me, I will not allow a bad experience stop you from experiencing one of the best RPGs ever made

    Edited:

    Just more dynamic animations with proper hitboxes, and being able to counter, parry and block physical attacks with your own would be pretty cool. Although your attacks in Skyrim are directionally influenced it's just a bland sweep left or right, and all one/two-handed weapon defense comes down to just holding it infront of you to block things in that direction.
    The melee in Skyrim still suffers from the same problem as it did in Oblivion, and that's a lack of impact. It honestly feels like you aren't really cutting anything with your sword, more like you're just swiping them or bouncing off.

    Better weapon animations are always a given, but there also needs to be better enemy reactions to being hit as well. Skyrim did have staggers on low health and stuff, but it doesn't really feel like enough. Look at Condemned, a game from 2006, every single hit in that game is satisfying due to how enemies react to being hit.
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  18. Post #1938
    Gold Member
    RikohZX's Avatar
    September 2009
    15,719 Posts
    The melee in Skyrim still suffers from the same problem as it did in Oblivion, and that's a lack of impact. It honestly feels like you aren't really cutting anything with your sword, more like you're just swiping them or bouncing off.

    Better weapon animations are always a given, but there also needs to be better enemy reactions to being hit as well. Skyrim did have staggers on low health and stuff, but it doesn't really feel like enough. Look at Condemned, a game from 2006, every single hit in that game is satisfying due to how enemies react to being hit.
    It'd be neat to have different reaction types depending on the weapon affliction, armor, and damage location. Someone wearing armor should be able to take more damage than a bar patron in a silk shirt in the sense that hitting them with a sword to the torso has different effects rather than just stat differences.
    But then the number of animations you'd have to add in would be pretty crazy.
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  19. Post #1939
    KING
    of OVER – REACTING
    “No jokes allowed!!!”
    ROFLBURGER's Avatar
    May 2009
    31,836 Posts
    It'd be neat to have different reaction types depending on the weapon affliction, armor, and damage location. Someone wearing armor should be able to take more damage than a bar patron in a silk shirt in the sense that hitting them with a sword to the torso has different effects rather than just stat differences.
    But then the number of animations you'd have to add in would be pretty crazy.
    It would be worth it. I mean, they have the technology but they removed it for some fucking reason.

    There used to be a condition function that detected where the enemy was hit (came from fallout 3), but they removed it for some reason.
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  20. Post #1940
    Still Not GLOD
    WrathOfCat's Avatar
    May 2013
    1,091 Posts
    Anyone else getting really awful fps in some areas of tamriel rebuilt with openmw?

  21. Post #1941
    Gold Member
    gbtygfvyg's Avatar
    November 2006
    15,336 Posts
    So I finally tested the mod and the voice is extremely quiet. I can't hear her at all and it seems like a big portion of her lines aren't even voiced.

  22. Post #1942
    Gold Member
    RikohZX's Avatar
    September 2009
    15,719 Posts
    It would be worth it. I mean, they have the technology but they removed it for some fucking reason.

    There used to be a condition function that detected where the enemy was hit (came from fallout 3), but they removed it for some reason.
    There's also apparently the havok 'flinch' code where character models flinch back via physics in reaction to getting hit, but it's buggy and the only mod I saw that restored it wasn't exactly gleaming about the functionality.

  23. Post #1943
    Official worst poster 2011
    certified's Avatar
    June 2007
    9,610 Posts
    Schrodinger's Catgirl?


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  24. Post #1944
    Gold Member
    Rellow's Avatar
    February 2008
    5,816 Posts
    Schrodinger's Catgirl?


    It's a synth
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  25. Post #1945
    jonu67's Avatar
    September 2012
    4,076 Posts
    It's a synth
    That's actually her shadow, she just has a very visible one.
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  26. Post #1946
    Gold Member
    The Jack's Avatar
    August 2011
    4,901 Posts
    I've done that for other characters, but this particular one doesn't seem to have any facegen files. Just tri files. Is it possible it's using just these .tri files to generate it's unique face? The only solution I can think of if that's the case is getting them to be playable so I can pull up showracemenu and export their head as a standalone .nif, but I dunno how I'd do that.



    Morrowind's enemies were indeed pretty unique and interesting, which made Oblivion all the more troubling. Oblivion enemy design made me feel like I'm playing the idea of a generic fantasy RPG condensated into one game. Scamps were pretty much elongated Imps from World of Warcraft ffs.

    I agree with you on ghosts not being spookier aesthetically, but they were humanized because they gained a voice set. Why is the Falmer not being generic goblins bad? They have a unique background and design elements. Is that not good?

    If you want generic fantasy things, just get Immersive Creatures. It's got everything you want and more.
    Falmer being generic goblins was bad because, y'know, it was a waste of falmer. Falmer could have been so much more, so much cooler, and yet we they're just some kind of ice+chitin themed goblins with some little bit of lore about degredation. If Bethesda made goblins and scamps, and then had falmer left over, they might've decided to make something cool out of them. We don't even get Falmer ruins because they're just goblins.
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  27. Post #1947
    Ruby_Axe's Avatar
    May 2015
    1,118 Posts
    Falmer being generic goblins was bad because, y'know, it was a waste of falmer. Falmer could have been so much more, so much cooler, and yet we they're just some kind of ice+chitin themed goblins with some little bit of lore about degredation. If Bethesda made goblins and scamps, and then had falmer left over, they might've decided to make something cool out of them. We don't even get Falmer ruins because they're just goblins.
    I'm still hopeful that the conversations/involvement of Knight-Paladin Gelebor foreshadows a more interesting future for the Falmer, they seem like they could be a really interesting race, watching a civilization rise out of what are currently feral beasts
    Kinda like what happened to orcs but with more focus on a civilization actually developing rather than just appearing thanks to a Talos-flavoured Mcguffin

    I mean to be honest I know the Falmer ain't gonna turn up in any of the other TES games, but it'd be nice for it to at least appear in some books and general lore

  28. Post #1948
    Gold Member
    guicool-BR-'s Avatar
    December 2006
    1,661 Posts
    So I finally tested the mod and the voice is extremely quiet. I can't hear her at all and it seems like a big portion of her lines aren't even voiced.
    All Miraak lines were revoiced, but yes, they are a bit too low. I'm into that.

  29. Post #1949
    Gold Member
    DeEz's Avatar
    July 2006
    6,902 Posts
    All Miraak lines were revoiced, but yes, they are a bit too low. I'm into that.
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  30. Post #1950
    ColonelCorn's Avatar
    September 2008
    570 Posts
    It's clearly an ASMR follower.
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  31. Post #1951
    Ott
    Gold Member
    Ott's Avatar
    June 2012
    6,341 Posts
    All Miraak lines were revoiced, but yes, they are a bit too low. I'm into that.
    Look into dynamic range compression to maximize loudness

  32. Post #1952
    Gold Member
    guicool-BR-'s Avatar
    December 2006
    1,661 Posts
    It's clearly an ASMR follower.
    It's clearly me failing to write English properly

    I'm on it.
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  33. Post #1953
    Gold Member
    MrHeadHopper's Avatar
    July 2009
    4,470 Posts
    Speaking of not hearing things, sometimes when I move around when someone's talking they get like completely quiet as I'm panning around them, like my walking sounds override their speech for a sec. Is this something anyone else is experiencing? It's really odd and I can't really reproduce it, but it does happen mostly in first person.

  34. Post #1954
    Mr_Plumrich's Avatar
    December 2013
    153 Posts
    Speaking of not hearing things, sometimes when I move around when someone's talking they get like completely quiet as I'm panning around them, like my walking sounds override their speech for a sec. Is this something anyone else is experiencing? It's really odd and I can't really reproduce it, but it does happen mostly in first person.
    I believe that there is a "deaf angle". It happens to me when the one talking is behind me at roughly 7 or 5 o'clock. i.e. not right behind me, but behind and to the side. I do not really know how to explain this.
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  35. Post #1955
    KING
    of OVER – REACTING
    “No jokes allowed!!!”
    ROFLBURGER's Avatar
    May 2009
    31,836 Posts
    Skyrim's sound system is pretty bad. You can tell with stereo sounds that it isn't well designed.

    To see what I mean, continuously cast a healing spell and strafe around in a circle. If you have a headset it's very noticeable, idk if you would notice it as well with speakers.

  36. Post #1956
    Gold Member
    MrHeadHopper's Avatar
    July 2009
    4,470 Posts
    Skyrim's sound system is pretty bad. You can tell with stereo sounds that it isn't well designed.

    To see what I mean, continuously cast a healing spell and strafe around in a circle. If you have a headset it's very noticeable, idk if you would notice it as well with speakers.
    Yeah I used to play with a speaker setup and it was pretty fine until I killmoved a guy. KSHSHKHSSHKSSSSSSSHSHHS, those fucking metal grinding noises that happen are insanely loud.
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  37. Post #1957
    Gold Member
    _Maverick_'s Avatar
    November 2010
    9,287 Posts
    Yeah I used to play with a speaker setup and it was pretty fine until I killmoved a guy. KSHSHKHSSHKSSSSSSSHSHHS, those fucking metal grinding noises that happen are insanely loud.
    It's punishment, you did after all just kill a guy.

    Unrelated note, why do BETHESDA games have the worst crime and punishment system in gaming.
    "Hey wait I know you."
    Don't talk to them and literally walk away, punishment adverted.
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  38. Post #1958
    Gold Member
    MrHeadHopper's Avatar
    July 2009
    4,470 Posts
    It's punishment, you did after all just kill a guy.

    Unrelated note, why do BETHESDA games have the worst crime and punishment system in gaming.
    "Hey wait I know you."
    Don't talk to them and literally walk away, punishment adverted.
    That's for under 1k bounty. After 1k you get chased around, right?

    1k is too high a number anyways, but sometimes it's weird because I get like 50 bounty pickstealpocketing a man and he just calls the cops and they turn up SPRINTING going like "stop"

  39. Post #1959
    Gold Member
    Ganerumo's Avatar
    September 2011
    27,947 Posts
    1k is what you get for murder, it's fairly easy to get to.

    Funny thing is that murdering Thalmor agents barely gives you any bounty, since the guards and the jarls all despise the shit out of them .
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  40. Post #1960
    Tabasco Lord
    Arc Nova's Avatar
    September 2005
    13,700 Posts
    you can walk away from the "hey wait i know you" portion at any time iirc

    all they respond with is "alright then"
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