1. Post #481
    MC3craze's Avatar
    April 2009
    6,187 Posts
    I finally made it to the Mun. Sadly I think I put my rocket too close to the landing legs so when I landed my rocket blew up. No one died, but now they suffer a fate worse than death, stranded on the Mun.
    Did it just break off? Because that can happen even without hitting the surface.
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  2. Post #482
    USER HAS BEEN DISCONNECTED FROM REALITY - RETRY CONNECTION IN 5 MINUTES
    Dennab
    February 2006
    22,239 Posts
    Did it just break off? Because that can happen even without hitting the surface.
    It exploded. Maybe it broke off, then exploded. Either way I believe it was landing error on my part. I was moving sideways a lot faster than I anticipated. I'm going to try again, this time hopefully I can land the damn thing.
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  3. Post #483
    We're made of star-stuff
    LarparNar's Avatar
    February 2009
    10,085 Posts
    The Story of KSP — KSP 0.4

    Continuing with the story now, KSP 0.4 was when we first decided to tackle the big problem of terrain, in a planet-sized scale.

    I had been playing for a while with creating procedural things here, but they were pretty simple back then. I built this very simple asteroid generator here, mainly to prove to myself I could do it:


    I later built a noise-based terrain demo, but it would only create a flat world:


    The terrain system you see above did things using mesh tiles that would follow the player around, ‘leapfrogging’ over each other so that as you moved, the terrain farthest away from you would be moved forward, and you could go on infinitely with this system. But while cool, these square tiles would only work in a flat world, so we needed to think of something else.

    We needed something that would work for a round planet, and that’s when things started to get a little problematic.

    If you look around the internets for procedural terrain systems, you’ll find thousands and thousands of half-finished attempts, and about 99% of those are meant for games where the world can be flat. There are very, very few projects out there that have actually tackled the problem of generating planets, and the ones that did were very much over my head at that time.

    I was starting to feel I had bitten off more than I could chew with this one. But the game couldn’t go on without a terrain system, so I scrounged up the most of my brain I could, and came up with something that, well, it did kinda look like terrain at least, and it was round.

    It even had an atmosphere to it. This was done with ‘atmospheric scattering’ shaders, which were made accessible to the world by a guy called Sean O’Neil, who wrote an article about that on a developer publication called GPU Gems. Because of that, there were several atmo-scat shaders out there to use. They’re very fiddly to work with, but after a few days of tweaking, we ended up with this:


    This terrain system worked in a more or less similar way to the flat tile-based terrain. It used a noise system called LibNoise, which is a library you can download, and for which I found a Unity-friendly version, to give you a plug-and-play style noise generating toolset. It can do very amazing things, if you don’t need to worry about performance.

    In the flat world, converting this numerical noise into a terrain was pretty simple. We’d get a noise value from LibNoise for any given position in the world, and we’d push vertices upwards by that amount.

    For the planet thought, things aren’t that simple. For starters, ‘up’ is a very relative term when dealing with round things, so we can’t move vertices ‘up’ anymore. We have to ‘push’ them away from the center. Ok, not too much worse, but if you have a square set of tiles, how do you get those to wrap around a sphere? Ever tried giftwrapping a football? It’s more or less the same issue.

    My ‘solution’ (for lack of a better term) was to not use tiles at all, but a single, huge disk, that I had created in 3Ds Max. It was tessellated in several steps, so the center of the disk had a much higher polygon density than the edges:


    The idea behind this scheme was that the disk would follow the player around, and it would get larger if you went higher, and lower if you went closer to the ground. Because the disk was always just below you, the ‘tiers’ of mesh detail would work as a crude LOD system.

    It worked, to some extent, but there was a big problem. That disk mesh there had about 19,000 vertices on it, and by itself, unity was pretty ok with keeping them updated on every frame. The problem was that you needed to be able to collide with the terrain, and making that whole thing collision-enabled was simply impossible. Unity goes pretty fast until you need to use collision meshes on things that are changing shape, and that’s exactly what we had here.

    The solution for it was to let the terrain do it’s thing, and maintain a much smaller collision ‘area’ just under the player. It was invisible anyway, and small enough to run with good frames.

    Then there was another issue. Because the terrain was a disk, it’s vertices could potentially end up anywhere in the world, and that meant something very weird could (and did) happen. If on one frame a vertex was sitting on the top of a mountain, on the next one, it might be half-way down it’s slope, and there’d be no other vertex on the top. That means that as you went along, the terrain shimmered and wobbled because the noise ‘field’ was much more detailed than the mesh.

    The fix for that was to have the whole terrain only move if you went past a certain distance from it’s center. By reducing the frequency of terrain updates, it was less apparent that the terrain was wobbling the way it was.

    So at the end of that update cycle, this is what we ended up with:


    We used two disks here actually. One for the terrain, and another for the water. The textures were being handled by a shader I scrounged up from the internets and modified until it kinda worked. On this shot, you can actually see where the terrain disk ‘ends’ and the far-away planet begins.

    The far-away planet was another solution that had to be added. Because the terrain disk was ‘finite’, eventually it needed to be replaced by a less complicated visual representation of a planet. That was done by having a simple textured sphere placed ‘under’ the disk-terrain, and have it drawn to the screen before the terrain was. That, coupled with a terrain shader that could fade away as it went farther from the camera, made for the first version of a planetary terrain that actually met the basic requirements.

    We were to find out later, that this system didn’t actually meet all the requirements. But that’s another story for later. For now, we were content with what we had, and started to think about actually bringing the characters into the game.

    Cheers
    http://kerbalspace.tumblr.com/post/1...of-ksp-ksp-0-4
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  4. Post #484
    Gold Member
    Pelf's Avatar
    September 2007
    2,932 Posts
    Is it possible to make particle effects?
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  5. Post #485
    Gold Member
    CardBoardBox's Avatar
    December 2006
    1,645 Posts
    messing with the Mir station accessories.

    looking for a unified weight system.... any thoughts?


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  6. Post #486
    Gold Member
    JohnFisher89's Avatar
    August 2007
    1,839 Posts
    Now we need a mars
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  7. Post #487
    HUGE NERD
    Dacheet's Avatar
    November 2007
    6,304 Posts
    Now we need a mars
    Or -- as Harvester said before -- a whole SOLAR SYSTEM instead of a single planet per update
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  8. Post #488
    MC3craze's Avatar
    April 2009
    6,187 Posts
    I want more goddamn instruments.

    Maybe an MFD?
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  9. Post #489
    Gold Member
    DrasarSalman's Avatar
    August 2009
    10,631 Posts
    I want more goddamn instruments.

    Maybe an MFD?
    I want a piano.
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  10. Post #490
    HUGE NERD
    Dacheet's Avatar
    November 2007
    6,304 Posts
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  11. Post #491
    Gold Member
    CardBoardBox's Avatar
    December 2006
    1,645 Posts
    I was in class and bored as the prof turned off the internet for us. luckily I brought my KSP.
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  12. Post #492
    Best Poster
    Saza's Avatar
    July 2009
    19,032 Posts
    give me those damn parts already D:
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  13. Post #493
    Mp6
    Mp6's Avatar
    March 2007
    395 Posts
    Is there a difference between the pre-order version and the demo currently?
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  14. Post #494
    Gold Member
    finbe's Avatar
    June 2010
    2,199 Posts
    Is there a difference between the pre-order version and the demo currently?
    Not until 0.14 comes out
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  15. Post #495

    April 2011
    4,463 Posts
    Is there a difference between the pre-order version and the demo currently?
    You should probably pre-order it soon though, as the prices will go up once they release 0.14.
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  16. Post #496
    MC3craze's Avatar
    April 2009
    6,187 Posts
    KSP works in Windows 8. Woo
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  17. Post #497
    We're made of star-stuff
    LarparNar's Avatar
    February 2009
    10,085 Posts
    KSP works in Windows 8. Woo
    I've had Windows 8 ever since the developer preview came out
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  18. Post #498
    MC3craze's Avatar
    April 2009
    6,187 Posts
    Metro UI is very good by the way.
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  19. Post #499
    Gold Member
    CardBoardBox's Avatar
    December 2006
    1,645 Posts
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  20. Post #500
    HUGE NERD
    Dacheet's Avatar
    November 2007
    6,304 Posts
    Now dock to--
    Oh... :sigh:
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  21. Post #501
    We're made of star-stuff
    LarparNar's Avatar
    February 2009
    10,085 Posts
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  22. Post #502
    MC3craze's Avatar
    April 2009
    6,187 Posts
    :fap:
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  23. Post #503
    HUGE NERD
    Dacheet's Avatar
    November 2007
    6,304 Posts
    Right, let's make a to-do list for 0.14

    * Large Orbital Collider
    * SPACE STATION :fap:
    * MUNAR SPACE STATION :fap: x2
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  24. Post #504
    Best Poster
    Saza's Avatar
    July 2009
    19,032 Posts
    the only problem I can see is if people slightly edit parts etc it'll wreck their station for everyone else
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  25. Post #505
    MC3craze's Avatar
    April 2009
    6,187 Posts
    Penis station is being rolled out to the pad.
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  26. Post #506
    We're made of star-stuff
    LarparNar's Avatar
    February 2009
    10,085 Posts
    HarvesteR's post in the dev thread doesn't seem to match entirely up with the tweet:

    Well, more news now here:

    I've been working on more details of the persistence system (the details keep on coming), and solved a couple more issues here.

    Restarting a flight is now possible by quickloading while in game (if for some reason you don't like your flight), or after you crash as an option on the flight-end screen.

    The 'Restart Flight' option is only available though, if you've launched the ship on the same flight session. Otherwise it makes very little sense, because there is no clear starting point when you resume a flight in progress. The quickload is always reset when the game goes into the flight scene though, so both work for a restart from the launchpad, and quickload works to restart from when you entered the flight.

    I also set up some restrictions here to prevent you from doing a save-and-exit if you're in a situation where the game state can't be saved (like in an atmosphere or under acceleration). Saving in these circumstances isn't possible for the very same reasons you can't time warp in those cases. We assume that all saved files will be potentially propagated through the rails system (as they are on the tracking station), and as we all know, the rails system can't process accelerations other than that of gravity, so it makes more sense to not allow you to save right there than to save a ship with it's engines running and not have it accelerate.

    This means the flight scene reflow, as I called it, is pretty much done. That leaves us with finishing up the update tool, some compatibility checks, the vessel switching and the tracking station, a picture of which I was just able to upload:



    So, let's get to it

    Cheers
    The thread is going nuts with people screaming at clouds, not realizing that there's always been clouds in the launchpad/VAB overview.

    Edited:

    Wow how is this late MC3craze
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  27. Post #507
    HUGE NERD
    Dacheet's Avatar
    November 2007
    6,304 Posts
    I'm expecting it late tomorrow or early Thursday.
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  28. Post #508
    MC3craze's Avatar
    April 2009
    6,187 Posts
    -snip-
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  29. Post #509
    provides mlp plot free of charge
    Oicani Gonzales's Avatar
    February 2011
    17,356 Posts
    Finally bought it, yay!
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  30. Post #510
    Gold Member
    CardBoardBox's Avatar
    December 2006
    1,645 Posts
    stations are hardly possible with out docking. must change that to space fleet.
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  31. Post #511
    HUGE NERD
    Dacheet's Avatar
    November 2007
    6,304 Posts
    stations are hardly possible with out docking. must change that to space fleet.
    Nor is it really logical. I'd prefer to launch a station piece by piece each in their own nice packaging, as opposed to the huge honking thing being barely lifted into orbit as a whole.
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  32. Post #512
    cwook's Avatar
    March 2010
    1,473 Posts
    stations are hardly possible with out docking. must change that to space fleet.
    Nor is it really logical. I'd prefer to launch a station piece by piece each in their own nice packaging, as opposed to the huge honking thing being barely lifted into orbit as a whole.
    What about space station fleets?
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  33. Post #513
    HUGE NERD
    Dacheet's Avatar
    November 2007
    6,304 Posts
    GUYS I GOT IT

    Launch rockets with each little part on it
    put them in orbit right next to each other.

    I'll take my Nobel prize.
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  34. Post #514
    Fuck Bitches, Get Scritches
    Suitcase's Avatar
    April 2005
    1,319 Posts
    I want to be able to launch an orbiting Vehicle Assembly Building so I can construct ships in orbit, dammit! >:[!
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  35. Post #515
    Gold Member
    CardBoardBox's Avatar
    December 2006
    1,645 Posts
    I want to be able to launch an orbiting Vehicle Assembly Building so I can construct ships in orbit, dammit! >:[!
    like boeing proposed for the shuttle?
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  36. Post #516
    Dumb Americunt
    MadCatMkII's Avatar
    May 2010
    8,803 Posts


    hnnnng Saturn V why are you so sexy?
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  37. Post #517
    Gold Member
    finbe's Avatar
    June 2010
    2,199 Posts
    Since 0.14 is going to be released in a bit, please send me a message of what part packs you want in the facepunch Collaborative Spess Station Pack. I will post a list of the mod that you guys have in the pack, and then we will move on to the next stage, building the stations with the suggested mods/packs.
    Also for a summary of what the FPCSSP is, view this link http://www.facepunch.com/threads/115...=#post34251052
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  38. Post #518
    Captain Armed Dildo, Master of Ratings
    cpt.armadillo's Avatar
    February 2011
    5,459 Posts
    K/W Challenger, it easy to use.
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  39. Post #519
    HUGE NERD
    Dacheet's Avatar
    November 2007
    6,304 Posts
    like boeing proposed for the shuttle?
    waitwhat?
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  40. Post #520
    Gold Member
    finbe's Avatar
    June 2010
    2,199 Posts
    K/W Challenger, it easy to use.
    Challenger, CardBoardBox's pack, Novapunch remix, DERP co (for the habitation modules), and the probodobyne pack, Agree if this is a good list, and reply to the post for any suggestions for more packs, and other things.
    Edit: Also, the node.
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