1. Post #26801
    Angel of Death
    jiggu's Avatar
    July 2007
    8,995 Posts
    Is the Graal Spike Thrower supposed to hit targets half a second after you've fired? I don't know if it's the ludicrous lag I have today or if it's the weapon but I hear the sound and enemies die about half a second after I've fired and felt the recoil.
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  2. Post #26802
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    "So why DID that country try to invade us?"
    "Who cares they're all dead lol"

    Like I said, war needs to be more than "They're attacking us! We need to beat them!", there has to be some sort of purpose behind it, otherwise it's just mindless action and fighting with little justification.
    But the Reapers have never really been important to Mass Effect as a story. They're just the boogy men in the background who threaten evrything you love. The people and places are the important part of Mass Effect. The intergalctic politics and how this wide array of people deal with each other.

    We rarely see the Reapers outside of ME3, and even thenthey act as motivators and set pieces to the interactions of galactic society. People get wrapped up in the whole "War for Earth" and "the Reapers are coming" thing, but really the Reapers are the least important part of Mass Effect as a narrative.
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  3. Post #26803
    Mr. Scorpio's Avatar
    May 2010
    10,614 Posts
    If we don't understand why the enemy were fighting then the whole war was just a pointless waste of life.
    I have absolutely no idea how this works

    people died because they were trying to keep all of life from being eradicated by cthulhu robots, that seems like a pretty justified reason to die
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  4. Post #26804
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    But the Reapers have never really been important to Mass Effect as a story. They're just the boogy men in the background who threaten evrything you love. The people and places are the important part of Mass Effect. The intergalctic politics and how this wide array of people deal with each other.
    what
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  5. Post #26805
    Mr. Scorpio's Avatar
    May 2010
    10,614 Posts
    they haven't

    same way that the motivation of the Emperor isn't important in star wars


    he's just fucking evil
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  6. Post #26806
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    If we don't understand why the enemy were fighting then the whole war was just a pointless waste of life.
    How is it a pointless waste of life? It was a fight for survival. You either fight, giving you a slim chance of survival, or you die, in which case you're now dead.

    Understanding why the Reapers are attacking doesn't change the fact that they want to wipe us out. It doesn't help us defeat them and it doesn't broaden our perception of anything.
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  7. Post #26807
    Gold Member
    XanaToast.'s Avatar
    July 2010
    7,966 Posts
    Is the Graal Spike Thrower supposed to hit targets half a second after you've fired? I don't know if it's the ludicrous lag I have today or if it's the weapon but I hear the sound and enemies die about half a second after I've fired and felt the recoil.
    i've had the same problem, the servers have been incredibly slow today, most of my guns dont hit until 4 seconds after
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  8. Post #26808
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    How is it a pointless waste of life? It was a fight for survival. You either fight, giving you a slim chance of survival, or you die, in which case you're now dead.

    Understanding why the Reapers are attacking doesn't change the fact that they want to wipe us out. It doesn't help us defeat them and it doesn't broaden our perception of anything.
    But what if we DO eventually understand them and are able to argue against them? Their intentions might be incorrect, their reasoning inaccurate, or we could work out a way for them to serve their purpose another way without eradicating life.
    I think that would be a brilliant way of resolving the conflict, if we manage to slowly convince the reapers that their motivations are wrong. Slowly, throughout the whole game, just like it works out with TIM.
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  9. Post #26809
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    They're the Empire from Star Wars or Sauron from the Lord of the Rings. They aren't important and only serve as a motivator for the story to continue. Mass Effect isn't about the Reapers, it's about Shepard and, more importantly, his relationships and the conflicts he faces within his world. The Reapers are a call to action, not a real faction or a character.

    It's like a zombie movie. The zombies aren't the important part. The people trying to survive and the conflicts they have with each other is. Once you start focusing on the faceless bad guys with unknowable motivation you lose sight of the characters who are actually important.
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  10. Post #26810
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    they haven't

    same way that the motivation of the Emperor isn't important in star wars


    he's just fucking evil
    Isn't the Emperor's motivation in Star Wars to create a stable, peaceful galaxy, if done so with an iron fist?
    That's a pretty common dilemma - The imperialistic, fascist emperor seeking stability in favour of freedom, in conflict with the "Rebels" who seek liberation. Neither side is necessarily "Evil", they just have opposing causes.
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  11. Post #26811
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    But what if we DO eventually understand them and are able to argue against them? Their intentions might be incorrect, their reasoning inaccurate, or we could work out a way for them to serve their purpose another way without eradicating life.
    I think that would be a brilliant way of resolving the conflict, if we manage to slowly convince the reapers that their motivations are wrong. Slowly, throughout the whole game, just like it works out with TIM.
    That would only work if the Reapers were willing to listen. Which they aren't. They have made it abundantly clear throughout the series that they consider us to be pathetic and that they are "infinitely [our] greater".

    Would Luke Skywalker have done better if he had understood the Emperor's motivations? No, the Emperor is just evil.
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  12. Post #26812
    Mr. Scorpio's Avatar
    May 2010
    10,614 Posts
    But what if we DO eventually understand them and are able to argue against them? Their intentions might be incorrect, their reasoning inaccurate, or we could work out a way for them to serve their purpose another way without eradicating life.
    I think that would be a brilliant way of resolving the conflict, if we manage to slowly convince the reapers that their motivations are wrong. Slowly, throughout the whole game, just like it works out with TIM.
    are you honestly saying that we could reason with the machines that have been eradicating all sentient life in the galaxy for tens of millions of years
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  13. Post #26813
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    It's like a zombie movie. The zombies aren't the important part. The people trying to survive and the conflicts they have with each other is. Once you start focusing on the faceless bad guys with unknowable motivation you lose sight of the characters who are actually important.
    Even zombies have justification in that usually they're just mindless, violent drones that can't help but attack everything.
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  14. Post #26814
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    Isn't the Emperor's motivation in Star Wars to create a stable, peaceful galaxy, if done so with an iron fist?
    That's a pretty common dilemma - The imperialistic, fascist emperor seeking stability in favour of freedom, in conflict with the "Rebels" who seek liberation. Neither side is necessarily "Evil", they just have opposing causes.
    No. The Emporor is just evil and loves being evil. He's not at all a deep character. He just wants

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  15. Post #26815
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    are you honestly saying that we could reason with the machines that have been eradicating all sentient life in the galaxy for tens of millions of years
    Only because they think that we can never comprehend them - What if they're just underestimating us (Or shepard at least), and we do manage to gather some understanding behind their reasoning?
    If they realise that we're beginning to understand, they might be more willing to listen. It's like ignoring a child because you don't think they'd understand, then realising that they can.
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  16. Post #26816
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    Even zombies have justification in that usually they're just mindless, violent drones that can't help but attack everything.
    That's not a motivation. That's just zombies being the device they were designed to be.
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  17. Post #26817
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    That's not a motivation. That's just zombies being the device they were designed to be.
    They can't HAVE a motivation because they're mindless.

    Edited:

    No. The Emporor is just evil and loves being evil. He's not at all a deep character. He just wants

    Even seeking power is a justification. It's SOMETHING to go on, rather than just "KILL EVERYTHING FOR THE HELL OF IT".
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  18. Post #26818
    CLungcancer's Avatar
    August 2008
    1,264 Posts
    I liked sovereign because he (it?) was so mysterious, almost like an god like entity that had reasons we could not understand. Reapers maintained that mysterious and magical feel pretty well and then the star child spews some nonsense at me :(
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  19. Post #26819
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    I liked sovereign because he (it?) was so mysterious, almost like an god like entity that had reasons we could not understand. Reapers maintained that mysterious and magical feel pretty well and then the star child spews some nonsense at me :(
    Do you want Space Magic or don't you want Space Magic?
    MAKE UP YOUR MINDS
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  20. Post #26820
    Mr. Scorpio's Avatar
    May 2010
    10,614 Posts
    Isn't the Emperor's motivation in Star Wars to create a stable, peaceful galaxy, if done so with an iron fist?
    That's a pretty common dilemma - The imperialistic, fascist emperor seeking stability in favour of freedom, in conflict with the "Rebels" who seek liberation. Neither side is necessarily "Evil", they just have opposing causes.
    is that why he created a galactic war
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  21. Post #26821
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    Even seeking power is a justification. It's SOMETHING to go on, rather than just "KILL EVERYTHING FOR THE HELL OF IT".
    No one said they're killing everything for the hell of it. They're killing us for a reason that should never beexplained to us. They're the most powerful thing in the galaxyand they don't give a shit about what we have to say. They wont listen to us because they're arrogant. Wouldn't you be after at least 37 million years of dominance?

    Also, having no motivation and having a motivation that's never explained and never intended to be explained are fuctionally the same thing.
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  22. Post #26822
    Scar's Avatar
    September 2010
    4,148 Posts
    Do you want Space Magic or don't you want Space Magic?
    MAKE UP YOUR MINDS
    One mysterious, unknowable faction =/= ending a trilogy with lore breaking space magic
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  23. Post #26823
    Mr. Scorpio's Avatar
    May 2010
    10,614 Posts
    Only because they think that we can never comprehend them - What if they're just underestimating us (Or shepard at least), and we do manage to gather some understanding behind their reasoning?
    If they realise that we're beginning to understand, they might be more willing to listen. It's like ignoring a child because you don't think they'd understand, then realising that they can.
    what so we wheel out stephen hawking to have an intellectual debate with sovereign while he throatfucks the citadel

    what are you even talking about, that's fucking retarded
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  24. Post #26824
    Chief Gunnery Sgt. of the SS Shitpost
    Skyward's Avatar
    March 2009
    13,845 Posts
    Do you want Space Magic or don't you want Space Magic?
    MAKE UP YOUR MINDS
    There's a pretty big difference between space magic and a motivation that's beyond our comprehension.
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  25. Post #26825
    Mr. Scorpio's Avatar
    May 2010
    10,614 Posts
    They can't HAVE a motivation because they're mindless.

    Edited:



    Even seeking power is a justification. It's SOMETHING to go on, rather than just "KILL EVERYTHING FOR THE HELL OF IT".
    they make more reapers out of people goo

    is that motivation any better than UNLIIIIMITEEED, POWWWAAARRRR?
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  26. Post #26826
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    No one said they're killing everything for the hell of it. They're killing us for a reason that should never beexplained to us. They're the most powerful thing in the galaxyand they don't give a shit about what we have to say. They wont listen to us because they're arrogant. Wouldn't you be after at least 37 million years of dominance?
    And what if Shepard manages to prove himself to the Reapers by gathering an understanding of what they want? What if their arrogance is unfounded, and Shepard proves them wrong? It could happen.
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  27. Post #26827
    Mr. Scorpio's Avatar
    May 2010
    10,614 Posts
    There's a pretty big difference between space magic and a motivation that's beyond our comprehension.
    it's the difference between cthulhu and care bear stares

    Edited:

    And what if Shepard manages to prove himself to the Reapers by gathering an understanding of what they want? What if their arrogance is unfounded, and Shepard proves them wrong? It could happen.
    how the fuck would that even work if you don't know what it is that they want

    jesus christ you're like a black hole of bad opinions
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  28. Post #26828
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    Do you want Space Magic or don't you want Space Magic?
    MAKE UP YOUR MINDS
    He didn't say anything about wanting space magic. He said Sovereign presented himself like a god, not that he actually was one. Then starchild comes along and shits all over the Reapers s they're no longer threatening.
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  29. Post #26829
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    they make more reapers out of people goo

    is that motivation any better than UNLIIIIMITEEED, POWWWAAARRRR?
    Thing is that doesn't fit in, because it's a nice simple explanation, so why would they bother hiding it rather than being all "YOU CANNOT COMPREHEND US"

    Edited:

    how the fuck would that even work if you don't know what it is that they want
    He could find some clue, piece together the puzzle, form a basis for an understanding of why they exist. Then he confronts them with it and they eventually fill in the blanks.
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  30. Post #26830
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    And what if Shepard manages to prove himself to the Reapers by gathering an understanding of what they want? What if their arrogance is unfounded, and Shepard proves them wrong? It could happen.
    The Reapers have shown nothing but disinterest in everything we said. They ignore us and belittle us. Why? Because they don't give a turgid shit about anything we say. As far as they're concerned they're right and we're dumb primatives who can't possibly comprehend them.

    We can't EVER negotiate with them. They wont listen.
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  31. Post #26831
    Gold Member
    guicool-BR-'s Avatar
    December 2006
    1,271 Posts
    Even zombies have justification in that usually they're just mindless, violent drones that can't help but attack everything.
    Justification != Importance to the story.

    Edited:

    The Reapers have shown nothing but disinterest in everything we said. They ignore us and belittle us. Why? Because they don't give a turgid shit about anything we say. As far as they're concerned they're right and we're dumb primatives who can't possibly comprehend them.

    We can't EVER negotiate with them. They wont listen.
    Not even the geth are considered, they are just tools for them.
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  32. Post #26832
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    The Reapers have shown nothing but disinterest in everything we said. They ignore us and belittle us. Why? Because they don't give a turgid shit about anything we say. As far as they're concerned they're right and we're dumb primatives who can't possibly comprehend them.

    We can't EVER negotiate with them. They wont listen.
    What I'm trying to say here is that we PROVE that we're not just dumb primitives and that we CAN and WILL find out why they're doing it.
    Like I said before, it's like ignoring a child because "They couldn't possibly understand it", when suddenly they turn out to understand the theory of relativity or something.
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  33. Post #26833
    Gold Member
    Mingebox's Avatar
    February 2010
    13,883 Posts
    Just watch this conversation:
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_NAoNd4YyY
    Like I said on the last page, the Reapers were such great villains because of how their way of thinking as so alien to organics. They weren't motivated by the same sort of logic we were used to.
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  34. Post #26834
    Gold Member
    Whatsinaname's Avatar
    February 2006
    6,536 Posts
    What I'm trying to say here is that we PROVE that we're not just dumb primitives and that we CAN and WILL find out why they're doing it.
    Like I said before, it's like ignoring a child because "They couldn't possibly understand it", when suddenly they turn out to understand the theory of relativity or something.
    Except that the Reapers don't see organics as "children". They see organics as insects, or maybe even less than that. To them, organics are just an "accident" and they view themselves as the "pinnacle of evolution and existence". With that in mind, do you honestly think they give a fuck about what organics think?
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  35. Post #26835
    Gold Member
    guicool-BR-'s Avatar
    December 2006
    1,271 Posts
    What I'm trying to say here is that we PROVE that we're not just dumb primitives and that we CAN and WILL find out why they're doing it.
    Like I said before, it's like ignoring a child because "They couldn't possibly understand it", when suddenly they turn out to understand the theory of relativity or something.
    Please read this page: Abusive Precursors
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  36. Post #26836
    ParoshWasHere's Avatar
    October 2011
    528 Posts
    I was re-doing the mission on Tuchanka while listening to my own music and got to the elevator part. Before it got to the final dialouge, I paused the game to stop my music and put the in-game music on again, when suddenly this song plays.


    Started dancing for no reason.
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  37. Post #26837
    Gold Member
    Janus Vesta's Avatar
    May 2007
    11,409 Posts
    What I'm trying to say here is that we PROVE that we're not just dumb primitives and that we CAN and WILL find out why they're doing it.
    Like I said before, it's like ignoring a child because "They couldn't possibly understand it", when suddenly they turn out to understand the theory of relativity or something.
    Yes, we prove that we can understand them. Then we get harvested anyway because understanding them doesn't magically make them care and it doesn't protect us from superheated liquid metal deathrays.
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  38. Post #26838
    Gold Member
    Darth_GW7's Avatar
    March 2008
    7,680 Posts
    Like I said on the last page, the Reapers were such great villains because of how their way of thinking as so alien to organics. They weren't motivated by the same sort of logic we were used to.
    Which is why it would have been incredibly interesting to find out what they state their reasoning to be.
    It could still be absolutely alien to us, despite it seeming to make perfect sense to them. The point is that they provide us with an explanation, a purpose, rather than just "We just kill you all."
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  39. Post #26839
    Angel of Death
    jiggu's Avatar
    July 2007
    8,995 Posts
    i've had the same problem, the servers have been incredibly slow today, most of my guns dont hit until 4 seconds after
    I read on the wiki that it's actually supposed to be a delay inbetween your bullets hitting your target and you firing the shotgun. However it's probably supposed to be shorter but thanks to shitty servers it's still a pretty big delay.
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  40. Post #26840
    Gold Member
    Robber's Avatar
    January 2006
    5,823 Posts
    But the Reapers have never really been important to Mass Effect as a story. They're just the boogy men in the background who threaten evrything you love. The people and places are the important part of Mass Effect. The intergalctic politics and how this wide array of people deal with each other.

    We rarely see the Reapers outside of ME3, and even thenthey act as motivators and set pieces to the interactions of galactic society. People get wrapped up in the whole "War for Earth" and "the Reapers are coming" thing, but really the Reapers are the least important part of Mass Effect as a narrative.
    They're as much an integral part of Mass Effect as the Empire is in Star Wars. If in the final scene of Episode 6 they had explained that the Empire never really was evil, but the meta-Empire just controlled them to ensure freedom for the Republic it would have been as stupid as ME3's ending.
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