1. Post #681
    I SHOULDN'T OWN A FIREARM
    GunFox's Avatar
    May 2005
    7,543 Posts
    If you move a kiowa into spotting range, can Apaches fire at them from beyond visual range?
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  2. Post #682
    I survived Camp FP 2010
    LordLoss's Avatar
    January 2007
    2,692 Posts
    No.
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  3. Post #683
    I SHOULDN'T OWN A FIREARM
    GunFox's Avatar
    May 2005
    7,543 Posts
    Wow that sucks.

    Can't talk about "advanced" American hardware and then forget to include the giant lynchpin that is the backbone of American tank busting in the 1980's. The AH-64A's laser designator is located on the nose and requires the target be lit up for the entire flight. The Idea was that the kiowa could pop up, light up a target from relative safety, and the Apache would launch the hellfires as indirect fire weapons. Nobody was stupid enough to think that USSR convoys wouldn't have AA coverage. This is like including the Mi-24 and removing its ability to carry troops.

    Without kiowas or other indirect targeting capabilities, the hellfire is really pretty mediocre.
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  4. Post #684
    Gold Member
    Tac Error's Avatar
    September 2007
    5,085 Posts
    When the U.S. Army first fielded the OH-58D in the 1980s, its role was restricted to field artillery observation, source is the U.S. Army Historical Summary of 1986:

    In another upgrade effort, the Army Helicopter Improvement Program (AHIP), the service received the first production OH-58D observation helicopters. A refurbished OH-58A, the OH-58D (commonly referred to as the AHIP) is fitted with a mast-mounted sight that enables the aircraft to operate at night and in other conditions of limited visibility. The sight incorporates a special television, a thermal imaging system, and a laser designator-range finder. Using the sight, the crew can scout and direct artillery fire while hovering behind trees and hilltops, safe from direct enemy fire. Although the AHIP is designed to be used in attack, cavalry, and artillery roles, the Army confined its use to field artillery observation, approving an initial low rate of production and directing that a follow-on test be conducted. The Army, on 1 April 1986, formed a task force at the Aviation Center, Fort Rucker, Alabama, to remedy deficiencies in the AHIP.
    it wasn't until 1988 that plans called for such a hunter/killer concept, made possible by a $138 million expansion by U.S. congress, according to the '88 historical summary

    Edited:

    http://www.history.army.mil/books/DAHSUM/1986/ch04.htm

    The Army planned to discontinue the OH-58D AHIP in 1988, but Congress approved $138 million for its expansion.

    ---

    Despite its own impressive firepower, current planning calls for the AHIP to operate with the Apache as a hunter/killer team; the AHIP locates targets, and the Apache destroys them.
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  5. Post #685
    I survived Camp FP 2010
    LordLoss's Avatar
    January 2007
    2,692 Posts
    And the game likes to stop at 1985/6.
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  6. Post #686
    Gold Member
    Tac Error's Avatar
    September 2007
    5,085 Posts
    End date is 1985 but there's a loose leeway since Eugen wanted to add in "out of timeline" units
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  7. Post #687
    I SHOULDN'T OWN A FIREARM
    GunFox's Avatar
    May 2005
    7,543 Posts
    When the U.S. Army first fielded the OH-58D in the 1980s, its role was restricted to field artillery observation, source is the U.S. Army Historical Summary of 1986:



    it wasn't until 1988 that plans called for such a hunter/killer concept, made possible by a $138 million expansion by U.S. congress, according to the '88 historical summary

    Edited:

    http://www.history.army.mil/books/DAHSUM/1986/ch04.htm

    Ahhh my bad, had it in my head that it was 1985-1995 in terms of time frame. I was ten years shifted forward.

    Carry on! My mistake!

    Wow, the Apache really sucked for a while. I had never thought about the interim between the AH-64A and the introduction of the mast sight.

    Edited:

    EDIT: Wait wait wait.

    The Apache was officially introduced in 1986. I knew I wasn't crazy.

    The OH-58D hit in 1985.

    A huge part of the AHIP program was to match it up with the Apache.

    http://www.gao.gov/assets/140/139419.pdf

    Reports in 1983 mention using it to designate targets for attack helicopters.

    The use early on for artillery designation was purely a tactical choice, not a limitation of the mast sight. The mast sight was part of the D package.

    The OH-58 had already been working closely with cobras throughout Vietnam in order to direct the AH-1's where to launch their rockets.

    The funding for congress was, best I can tell, just to buy more of the things. Though it definitely did also include a tactical shift as well to the hunter killer design.

    It is still weird to have the Apache without the OH-58D, but if they are already bending the rules to include the apache at all, then whatever, I suppose.
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  8. Post #688
    Gold Member
    Killerjc's Avatar
    August 2008
    4,597 Posts
    gunfox-tac error fight
    it's an armchair general's wet dream
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  9. Post #689
    I SHOULDN'T OWN A FIREARM
    GunFox's Avatar
    May 2005
    7,543 Posts
    Nah, I know better than to mess with Tac Error too much. He is extremely well versed.
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  10. Post #690
    Jherkin Gherkin
    Dennab
    October 2010
    12,198 Posts
    im satan
    game needs ah56 cheyenne :(

    Edited:

    i wonder how many maps full game has
    the current 4 are getting mega stale
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  11. Post #691
    Gold Member
    Cap'nSpacePants's Avatar
    August 2011
    251 Posts
    Good god this game is like crack. After playing it so far, I've lost just about every time but I still can't help but love it. As I'm certain someone before me said, the little victories you get in every battle are just so satisfying, be it taking out a wave of transport helos with attack helicopters, or simply knocking out a couple of LAVs with AT infantry.

    That said I still rage like crazy when the enemy hits me with artillery nonstop.
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  12. Post #692
    Gold Member
    Tac Error's Avatar
    September 2007
    5,085 Posts
    i wonder how many maps full game has
    the current 4 are getting mega stale
    IIRC 22-24 they claimed in an interview, but don't quote me on it
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  13. Post #693
    Blitzkreig's Avatar
    August 2009
    784 Posts
    I'm so sick of Hell's Highway, I haven't had a good match on it since the beginning of the beta.
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  14. Post #694
    Gold Member
    Tac Error's Avatar
    September 2007
    5,085 Posts
    If you look at the sat view of Hell's Highway, more than half of the map is left unoccupied by zones. Why they did that is a mystery.
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  15. Post #695
    Jherkin Gherkin
    Dennab
    October 2010
    12,198 Posts
    one of these days ill get revenge on arty spammers

    i will airborne raid them
    there will be rangers, delta force, and many apaches and cobras
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  16. Post #696
    KommradKommisar's Avatar
    August 2009
    12,442 Posts
    I flank like a boss on that map.

    "haha! This dumb NATO player is turtling like a dum-"
    SUDDEN LEOPARD FLANK AND AIR CAV ATTACK

    After that, it's just a blitz to keep him off balance.
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  17. Post #697
    Grotsky's Avatar
    October 2010
    332 Posts
    Is this game worth the money?

    It seems like the artillery is overpowered at this point and I don't want a game where you can just spam a certain unit and win.
    It's honestly still worth it, I'm sure they'll nerf it for the release.
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  18. Post #698
    Gold Member
    kirderf's Avatar
    October 2005
    3,874 Posts


    Why was this a draw? Ruined my win streak.

    Edited:

    It's honestly still worth it, I'm sure they'll nerf it for the release.
    I honestly don't see the problem with arty. Sure, it can be a bit of a problem now and then, but it's nothing compared to a well managed attack force of pretty much anything. I think the purpose of arty is to prevent people from putting 200 tanks in a tiny bit of forest, making it impossible to penetrate.
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  19. Post #699
    Gold Member
    Mbbird's Avatar
    June 2008
    17,960 Posts
    All of my problems boil down to map scaling not being correct at all, and artillery aiming instantly.

    Edited:

    You know what, I think arty is avoidable, I may just be sperging out at nothing. I want to be optimistic and say there's a counter to everything. This game is fucking beautiful, especially with intelligent teammates (and enemies). Can't wait for the polished release.
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  20. Post #700
    I am a moderator.
    Swebonny's Avatar
    August 2006
    13,238 Posts
    I flank like a boss on that map.

    "haha! This dumb NATO player is turtling like a dum-"
    SUDDEN LEOPARD FLANK AND AIR CAV ATTACK

    After that, it's just a blitz to keep him off balance.
    This is playing in my head right now
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  21. Post #701
    MendozaMan's Avatar
    April 2007
    5,106 Posts
    This game looks really neat, since I loved winSPMBT when I was little. Tactics nut and lego builder 'n all that jazz.

    Of course I'm out of cash since my stereo soundboxes decided to blow their capacitors skyhigh out through the damn casing that held them in, and had to pay muchos dosho to get it fixed
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  22. Post #702
    I am a moderator.
    Swebonny's Avatar
    August 2006
    13,238 Posts
    This game looks really neat, since I lived winSPMBT when I was little. Tactics nut and lego builder 'n all that jazz.

    Of course I'm out of cash since my stereo soundboxes decided to blow their capacitors skyhigh out through the damn casing that held them in, and had to get to pay muchos dosho to get it fixed
    You'll love this game if you loved winSPMBT. The games are quite similar to each other
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  23. Post #703
    Gold Member
    Tac Error's Avatar
    September 2007
    5,085 Posts
    I stopped playing WinSPMBT after becoming frustrated with the opfire system. Good and comprehensive OOB, though. I wish WEE had WinSPMBT's year system so we can opt to play with units that were present in a specific time period.
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  24. Post #704
    Blitzkreig's Avatar
    August 2009
    784 Posts
    Did the devs promise full mod support? I remember reading that somewhere.
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  25. Post #705
    Azaz3l's Avatar
    April 2010
    1,993 Posts
    Did the devs promise full mod support? I remember reading that somewhere.
    They promised mod tools including :
    -Map Editor
    -Unit Editor
    -Mission Editor
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  26. Post #706
    Scar's Avatar
    September 2010
    4,175 Posts
    Downloading the game right now, any tips/advice you want to give me?

    Also, is there a FP group for this game on steam?
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  27. Post #707
    Gold Member
    Sgt Doom's Avatar
    March 2005
    20,513 Posts
    They promised mod tools including :
    -Map Editor
    -Unit Editor
    -Mission Editor
    Was on the fence about getting this game due to my inherent uselessness at RTS games bordering on stressful, but I think that might have tipped me over.
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  28. Post #708
    Craig Willmore's Avatar
    February 2011
    1,416 Posts
    You are now aware that artillery can be used as anti-aircraft.
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  29. Post #709
    Blitzkreig's Avatar
    August 2009
    784 Posts
    I knew that from the start.
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  30. Post #710
    Gold Member
    goon165's Avatar
    August 2006
    9,871 Posts
    You are now aware that artillery can be used as anti-aircraft.
    "oh look a Nato Heli rush"
    *Coats the area in Malka fire*
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  31. Post #711
    Azaz3l's Avatar
    April 2010
    1,993 Posts
    Rushing with T-34 full vet'd is fun, they cost 30 points each (with full vet.) and they can bust all abrams and leopards in hordes.

    Edited:

    Wargame is updating without any patch news. What
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  32. Post #712
    Gold Member
    goon165's Avatar
    August 2006
    9,871 Posts
    also Buks are very good at base defense AA, with accuracy 10 and HE 10 it's like shooting hyper accurate telephone poles at passing units.

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  33. Post #713
    Actually a cool guy
    David29's Avatar
    June 2005
    3,027 Posts
    Game updating. I wonder what's new.
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  34. Post #714
    Azaz3l's Avatar
    April 2010
    1,993 Posts
    - Main gun of the BMP 685 is renamed from 2A70 to 2A48-1. No change of stats, just an historical fixing.
    - Number of command stars needed to unlock the East-German MFRW BM-21 increase from 2 to 3.
    - Number of command stars needed to unlock the Soviet BMP-3 decrease from 4 to 3.
    - Ammo load for the BTR-152E ZPTU-2 & BTR-152E ZPTU-4 increase from 1.200 to 2.400.
    - Range of fire of the TOS-1 Buratino decrease from 4.900m to 3.500m (IRL range).
    - Fixing the TOS-1 Buratino minimum range so that he can't stun/harm itself.
    - Accuracy of the STROP-1 increase from 5 to 7.
    - Ammunitions load for the M53/59 Praga increase from 680 to 900.
    - Ammunitions load for the STROP-1 increase from 480 to 900.
    - Ammunitions load for the STROP-2 increase from 800 to 1.400.
    - Rate of fire of the M53/59 Praga, STROP-1 & STROP-2 slightly increased.
    - Price of STROP-1 increase of 5$.
    - Price of T-80 decrease of 5$.
    - Price of T-80B decrease of 5$.
    - Price of T-80BV decrease of 5$.
    - Price of T-80U decrease of 5$.
    - Price of T-72B increase of 25$.
    - Accuracy of the Rangers’ Redeye missile is increased from 4 to 8.
    - Accuracy of the TO-55 & Flammpanzer TO-55 decreases from 7 to 3.
    - Fixing the minimum range of the Spetsnaz's RPO Rys so that they can't stun/harm themselves.
    - Max. speed for M901 ITW increase from 60 to 65km/h.
    - Availability of MT-LB Shturm decrease from 12 8.
    - Number of soldier per Piechota Zmech. squad is 5. No change in their stats, they were already 5 but a graphical bug made them appear like 10.
    - Accuracy of MT-LB Strela-10 increase from 2 to 4.
    - Price of M201 MILAN decrease of 5$.
    - Price of M901 ITW decrease of 5$.
    - MG-3 ammos of Jaguar 2 decrease from 3.200 to 2.000 rounds.
    - Price of TOS-1 Buratino increase of 15$.
    - Price of Jaguar 2 increase of 5$.
    - Price of MT-LB Shturm increase of 5$.
    Yay more Warsaw Pact nerfs!

    Holy shit T-80U costs 160 points now instead of 165, what a price nerf!
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  35. Post #715
    gamerman345's Avatar
    April 2010
    2,432 Posts
    Yay more Warsaw Pact nerfs!

    Holy shit T-80U costs 160 points now instead of 165, what a price nerf!
    - Fixing the TOS-1 Buratino minimum range so that he can't stun/harm itself.
    - Accuracy of the STROP-1 increase from 5 to 7.
    - Ammunitions load for the M53/59 Praga increase from 680 to 900.
    - Ammunitions load for the STROP-1 increase from 480 to 900.
    - Ammunitions load for the STROP-2 increase from 800 to 1.400.
    - Rate of fire of the M53/59 Praga, STROP-1 & STROP-2 slightly increased.
    - Price of STROP-1 increase of 5$.
    - Price of T-80 decrease of 5$.
    - Price of T-80B decrease of 5$.
    - Price of T-80BV decrease of 5$.
    - Price of T-80U decrease of 5$.
    - Price of T-72B increase of 25$.
    Thats hardly a big nerf.
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  36. Post #716
    Azaz3l's Avatar
    April 2010
    1,993 Posts
    Why the fuck the patch is 1gb when all they've done is tweaking some values?
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  37. Post #717
    GAY FURRY PORN CONNOISSEUR

    August 2010
    2,208 Posts
    they are probably adding stuff to the game since it releases in 2 days
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  38. Post #718
    Gold Member
    Tac Error's Avatar
    September 2007
    5,085 Posts
    You are now aware that artillery can be used as anti-aircraft.
    One dude once wasted a whole bunch of MRL rockets just to shoot down my Mi-28A flight with them.
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  39. Post #719
    I am a moderator.
    Swebonny's Avatar
    August 2006
    13,238 Posts
    they are probably adding stuff to the game since it releases in 2 days
    Ah, so there's no need to redownload the full game?
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  40. Post #720
    Scar's Avatar
    September 2010
    4,175 Posts
    Whenever I'm about to join a Multiplayer game, I get this:

    Version : Final
    ACCESS VIOLATION (Reading 0x00000008)

    (0)
    (0)
    (0)
    (0)
    (0)
    (0)

    Occurred the 21/02/2012 (dd/mm/yyyy) at 22:46

    Core dumped in C:\Users\MadMaxJ\AppData\Local\Temp\000026_WarGame Final_29.dmp for post-mortem analysis.

    The call stack was copied to the clipboard.

    Press OK to report the dump by mail, CANCEL to quit.
    halp pl0x
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