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Post #41That's why it's an analogy. If the food was his shit, it would be a tautology.
Regarding this topic:
The reaction thread on Trello: funny.
The fact that Garry is cracking jokes about TPV: encouraging.
The fact that he hasn't officially ruled out such a dunderheaded idea: concerning.
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I don't know... that's what I fear.
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Guys i heard Garry is deleting the whole game soon is this true?
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lol
bigger lol
this must be winner..
biggest lol!
you obv didn't play bf or you just suck that bad..
it's obviuos you don't pvp in rust tho..
just don't understand why spend time to write this nonsense..
well.. kids with nothing to do i guess...
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This decision still pisses me off. I understand they didn't want this to be a zombie survival game, but the zombies were good placeholders (balanced, fit them theme for the loot they carried and being located in radtowns) until they came up with something better.
They knew nearly everyone absolutely hates the wolves in this game. But they really did replace a balanced feature of the game most people didn't mind with something that is nearly universally hated and doesn't even make sense. Why would mutated bears/wolves be carrying the loot they drop? Ridiculous. The removal of zombies and introduction of more annoying animals that can only be killed with ranged weapons (or a lot of luck and medkits) marked the time when I lost interest in playing vanilla Rust and started only logging in once in awhile to play on battlefield servers.
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Nice ad hominem.
This is me:
http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf4/user/xBluntski/
Stopping playing shortly after release due to the broken game.
Sniping is harder because bullet drop actually exists and you are able to see players much father away than in rust. The bolt has ZERO drop and is 100% accurate.
Aiming with the P250 in Rust is a joke. It's range is absurd and it's extremely accurate. Trying doing what you do in Rust in BF4 with a pistol.
Rust has an M4 and an MP5. M4 is an absolute easy mode weapon and MP5 just takes a little bit of recoil control. Anyone saying you can just spray an AR in BF4 for kill is simply ignorant.
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Firstly you can stand protected behind cover and position your aim to be on the person before you step out, so that if you're decent at shooting you can correct it and kill them before they know what happened.
It would require a lot of work on the developers part to actually get the camera to cope with small interiors, and prevent clipping through objects. They'd need to make it clear what your character is doing in the animations and find a way to indicate recoil without actually giving you a reticle in third person.
The other option is to attach the camera to the shoulder like in dead space as someone here pointed out, but that would give you such a disadvantage in gunfights that no one would use it due to narrower and partially obstructed (by the back of your character) vision.
I don't see the point of going as far as to remove reticles and give you an immersive hud, just to add an option to float behind the character you're controlling.
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I don't understand this "kills the immersion" or "having a camera float behind your character is not life like". This is a game, it's not supposed to mimic real life, if it did none of us would be playing it. But for the sake of argument, do you think the 1st person view we have now is realistic? I dunno if it's just me but I have a much wider view of things and no one would be able to sneak up to me and shot me in the back while I'm hitting logs of wood with my stone.
Is it just me or does this immersion thing only come up when it's something you do not like, so you use this argument and forget about the other million things that are not life like in rust?
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Well aren't you quite the ninja. Do you have eyes in the back of your head, too?
Of course it's a video game, but some of us think that realism is one of the things that makes it great. Of course it'll never be that close to real life, everyone knows that. But does it hurt to try and get close? I think it makes the game more immersive.
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You are kidding me right?
There is no bullet travel or drop, every gun is laser accurate to its magical maximum range, after which the bullet vanishes.
Recoil follows a pattern, with a bit of practice you can kill people on full auto out to 75m plus.
Only reason gunplay in rust has any sort of challenge is that there is a lot more lag than in other shooters (even with the same ping) combined with everyone tearing around at a dead sprint 24/7. That combined with the extremely limited gun selection and rust is a mediocre FPS.
But hey, Rust isn't just a FPS, its an adversarial survival game. So yeah, if Facepunch can do a decent job of making a third person mode I'd be happy to see it replace first person mode.
Edited:
Nah, but it takes 1/2 sec to glance over your shoulder and humans are very good at picking up movement near the edge of vision. Also, you'll not just hear someone trying to sneak up on you through long grass but be able to pinpoint the exact direction. Not to mention, never confuse you own footsteps for someone else's.
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Not quite, but a good pair of ears does help, it was just to give some examples of unrealistic things in rust.
I agree with you, it's just that this whole immersion thing gets thrown around as an excuse quite frequently.
On the whole 3rd person issue, I would prefer to have adjustable 1st person so you could look in several directions (just like using your neck to look around) while keeping the direction you are going.
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Imo third person spoils this type of game. By putting it in, youre forcing everyone to use it or be at a disadvantage, the fact rust is first person is one of the things that makes it good and stand out from the other similar games.
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Bahahahaha..... Hackers fly through the air aim botting and third person is gonna ruin the game.
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As someone stated earlier, starting to fear the update rather than get excited by it :/ That's not how it should be, is it Garry?
I know he's joking by the "removing first-person" but I still do think he's going to add third-person...unfortuanately
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If first person gets removed, then fuck this game.
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The following is a joke:
Why bother finishing the game if there are so many gullible kids that bought it already? They are adding the third person cuz they planin to exploit some of them gullible console kids now, I tell You! When u buy rust u pay 20% for the game and 80% for it's potential. They know it, they use it. Economi veri hard!
The whole "shhh we be rewriting the game, cuz stuff is broken, cuz we bad at programming" is a cover up for "shhh we be secretly creating a console port, third person is a part of it, we get 9001 money!"
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So you are going to ruin this game after all....
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I hope it won't be 3rd person. It would make the game much worse atleast for me.
I don't like how 3rd person feels, feels too much like an "arcade" game.
Hope Garry is just trolling x.x
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this must be a troll
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guys, im sure we will all absolutely love our naked man GTA survival game. it will be awesome to get a new perspective of death by hackers, right?
But at least there will hopefully be an option for third and first person. though they will have to work out some rendering things so you cant use thirdperson to look around corners and all
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But hey, if they DO add third person they'll have to add a crosshair, right? unless aiming down the sight makes you go first person
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Instead of asking why we shouldn't have TPV, can someone actually give one single good reason why we should? So far we've heard only two legitimate reasons:
1) Exploiting the view to peak around corners, a la ISS and DayZ.
This is gameplay-breaking and a crutch for players who can't handle immersive FPV action.
2) Being able to stare at your avatar, aka visual masturbation.
Unlike other games, the avatar in Rust is miserable and unappealing. And that's fine, he should be... he's a cold, unwashed, bald man dressed in homemade rags that still smell like pigs and wolves.
Is that it? Does anyone have a better reason than either of those, something that answers the question "because players might want it"?
Optional TPV won't make me leave this game. Finding out that Garry and team spent a large amount of cycles making pretty-looking avatars, spiffy outfits and cool pickaxe animations so a bunch of casual tools could sit in their wooden house and dress/undress themselves like a fucking Ken doll with Mad Max outfits they bought for $5 on the website marketplace while the game goes another 5 months with no direction and minimal content... that might have me out the door and locking it behind me.
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[QUOTE=Warm;44758152]Nice ad hominem.
This is me:
http://battlelog.battlefield.com/bf4/user/xBluntski/
i play bf just for fun, but have almost 400 h of bf4 and some 200 bf3..
if you find shooting hard in bf4 then i don't know.. play more?
don't wont to go there..
especially when you are mentioning that and playing alpha game.. ridiculous.. but ot..
do you know how much bullet drop have srr-61? close to zero.. at 300 meters you aim at head.. you take 8x scope, you hold breath, and you have the easiest shot ever, you can aim on left or right eye if you want.. what's hard in that? larger distances are irrelevant because that's camping style, and you can shoot only standing distances..
oh yes, almost forgot - every sniper in bf have zeroing now.. so what bullet drop? lol..
every bolt rifle in games is 100% accurate..
it has zero drop, but it has crazy sway.. you cannot fast aim like in let's say bf, you cannot strafe and shoot like in let's say bf..
bolt is not easy weapon to shot at distance, especially at moving target..
as it isn't hard, it isn't easy.. i would like to see how easy it is for you in some arena..
don't take examples of shooting players who are farming, or looting, standing targets, or running nakeds..
you can only say about difficulty and skill in pvp encounters with geared enemies ofc in kevlars..
120 m is absurd range? wait? wtf? i shoot the ball that far.. you say it's absurd for a pistol? wtf?
accurate? again - of course it is.. huge recoil? yep.. quickly connecting shots? nope without no recoil hack..
bf and pistols? cmon.. most of them are easy to use.. much easier than p250..
this is just lol.. like really man.. so funny.. did you ever shoot with m4 in rust? you say it's easy mode?
what? if you want i challenge you in m4 fight.. i dye to see how easy it is..
you cannot even burst fire with m4 at more that 10 m.. and by burst fire i mean not even 2 bullets burst.. it's practically single fire weapon at distance.. but with huge recoil.. and you must follow running or guy who is returning fire, you must be quicker and more precise than him, you must hit him at least 6 times, and basically without headshot you are not gonna finish him..
mp5 don't need any explanation.. pretty much useless weapon at anything more than some 40 m.. beast in close range..
well.. you can spray most ar in bf4 and have a kill.. you will need to clear whole mag and have some attachments which benefit automatic fire, but you can just spray and pull down most ars and you will get kill..
but forget spraying.. nobody spray outside close range..
you can tap fire every weapon, in bursts large like 5 bullets and with little recoil control you are hitting most bullets..
in rust.. you just cannot tap fire m4 at distance..
you write bullshit man, without any sense.. but it's your right to do so.. just stop pls..
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If what you mean is sneaking up close to you from behind. That's not you seeing it through your peripheral vision; that's you hearing it, which is what audio's for.
Don't confuse a game being immersive with simulating real life.
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@Kudaaaa
Do you have any reading comprehension at all? Do you even know how to form a proper sentence?
I never said BF4 was hard. I said BF4 aiming is harder than Rust.
BF4 at launch was more broken than Rust.
Sniping is easier in Rust regardless of all this.
The P250 is easy as hell to use. We run 3v3 and 5v5 arenas constantly on my server.
This is simply false. Quickly connecting 2-3 shots is easy and simple enough to execute at medium range.
Bursting with an M4 is not hard. Maybe you need to control your recoil better, not me.
You can spray for a kill sure but then you are out of ammo ans screwed like you said. Regardless, spraying is less efficient and I don't know why this was made a talking point in the first place.
The shooting in Rust is artificially hard at the moment. Until the netcode is stable you can't really say anything about it.
Depends how large of a distance.
In the end you are trying to make out Rust to be a competitive combat game, which it's not.
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That's exactly what I meant, thanks for clarifying
I don't agree with you, because the third person model is the model you see on other people. If they want to make the model look good, they'll just have to make one model, same with clothes, weapons and tools. You just have a world model, you don't need a view model. The animations work the same, only need animations for world model, not for view model
It has a downside however, because for perfomance issues, world models are less detailed than view models. But we'll see what the devs come up with if they're indeed talking about the models. If they're not... oh well
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Anytime :)
I'm sure they could come up with a balanced approach, i.e. a clientside LOD set for the full body render that's ranged appropriately from the camera on whatever part of the body they end up putting it on. If Andre can work that amazing magic with his mesh blending shader, pseudo, "view-model," LOD's for the character world model would be a cakewalk.
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i can when i try.. i just don't want to spend to much time with discussion which isn't really discussion..
as for proper sentence.. well.. i understand english pretty well, as for grammar i suck and i don't bother..
can i ask you how many foreign languages you speak? i can guess - none..
so pls don't jump in your mouth because let's not go there and speak about education ;)
nope, you try and represent bf4 like some harder game which requires plenty of skill, and that's far from reality..
as for aiming, aiming is much harder in rust than in bf4 as much you think it isn't..
just today i play a one quick match of metro and was first from 64 players.. had some 105 40 score.. aiming? yeah.. soooo hard.. aek and spray all day long and killing 3 players with 1 mag.. so.. pls don't write stuff when you don't have idea what you are talking..
bf4 is now more broken than rust.. rust isn't broken in any way..
you mentioning netcode, and netcode is the thing why bf4 have problems and why you don't hit all shots..
in rust is quite opposite.. netcode is just fine, i am not talking about lagging, as that is most of the time client side issue, but you don't have problems with hitting guy 100 m in front of you..
it's not.. sniping as such doesn't exist in rust because there is no scope..
blabla.. arena is close range shooting, and while p250 is easiest weapon, arena is all but representative thing.. and it doesn't have place in this discussion..
yep, all is easy and simple lol..
again, lot of bullshit.. we are not talking about arena..
because it's possible in bf4 and not in rust.. just with mp5 and in really close range..
netcode have nothing with shooting.. recoil is most important thing, damage model, rate of fire, etc have.. all of which is hard in rust, harder than bf4 and cod, just cs require more skill..
lol
i am getting now why you think it's easy.. go outside arena and have some proper pvp fights vs good players at larger distances and you will start to understand that's shooting in rust is not that easy..
competitive combat game? wait what? you will put words in my mouth? don't do that kiddo, that's one of the worst thing you can do in discussion..
that's some "new thing" you kids like to throw in discussion when you don't have arguments..
ofc rust have nothing with competitive combat game (even tho you can have server setup that way with stats and such)..
but fact is gunplay in rust is great, really fun and rewarding.. requires plenty of skill and there's little luck involved.. and that's why so many players like pvp in rust and play game mostly because pvp..
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Because at all times you see the 3rd person. First person you dont know your friend say ate something. Or reloaded his weapon. Out of sight, out of mind as it were. Third person you know your character did X, so you expect a vixual representation of X on your model. First person you only see your arms, most times sound is enough.
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"Third Person
There’s been a lot of hysteria this week because we posted on our trello that we’re going to add third person. Don’t worry. We are aware of your knee jerk over-reactions. You can stop making petitions. We get that you have an opinion on it.
We’re adding it anyway. We’re not going to make decisions based on bulletin board theories. We’re going to make decisions based on what happens. Nothing is set in stone, if it’s shit and ruins gameplay we’ll remove it." - Garry Newman (May 9 Devlog)
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@Kudaaa
You just lost all credibility.
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I like it how regardless what people say on here,the developers don't give a crap.Its nice to see they heard the complaints.
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I think Garry is trying to say: "Trust me."
...and yes, I agree its good they hear us. This is a better "dialogue with the developers" than you are going to see in 90% of other games, whether they are at the alpha stage, or not.
As long as Garry is mindful of our concerns, then I really do trust him. He's been spot on, so far. Why screw it up now? I don't think he will.
You go, Garry!!!!
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nice explanation lol..
netcode have nothing with shooting mechanics.. period!
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Which is, in most situations, easily accomplished using the words "trust" and "me".
"Spare me your stupid knee-jerk histrionics, I'll do what I want" ... that sort of comes with a slightly different vibe.
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noo i hate third person
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I loved his quote on 3rd person view, he could care less about the whining and bitching on forums/petitions/redditt/your basement. If it sucks it will not remain, if people like the option it will be there. Quit whining about shit that is not even in the game yet and quit acting like you are the developers, they will make the game and your dumbass bought a very early access version of game thinking it would remain static.
Loved the new devblog though some real progress is being made and I am looking forward to returning to rust after it becoming stale.
Edit: I know it sounds like I am really looking forward to 3rd person when personally I like first person for rust. Dayz's engine is clunky and the map is so much more involved with buildings and objects that third person gave people the spatial awareness that makes moving around easier and less disorienting. I just liked his response of telling forum dwellers that they are going to try new things regardless of the whining. If it fits their vision for the game then why not try it out? It is like many of you think experimentation in this phase of development is blasphemous and that is annoying.
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They said it to you when you bought it:
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Because this game is solely first person is why I got attracted to Rust when there were multiple choices for alpha's like Dayz.
I just hope it stays at testing third person and doesn't become a permanent feature else I personally won't play it since I personally don't like the gameplay in third person shooters.
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