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Post #1(Sorry for my bad english)
Today, 29th March was banned for the following reason "facepunch_connected_VAC_banned" and did not know what to do, so I went googling and saw this reason I was banned was for HACK / MOD illegal, but I do not use any of those things and I do not know what to do, then come here to ask for your help, please help me bought the game recently and really into jogar.Não to know more what to do, PLEASE HELP!
(Sorry for my bad english, I'm typing by Google Translate)
Thankful des already
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VAC banned is VAC banned. As far as I know, only one single incident was false in the history of VAC.
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vI need help please, bought the game now and already one of desses.Ja error or do not know where else to go.
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HELP I HACKED AND NOW I CAN'T PLAY THE GAME!!!!!
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Buy the game again you hacker.
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::grabs popcorn::
Here we go!
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What's your Steam profile, zoidberg17?
Edited:
Also, nobody on Facepunch, at all, can do anything about VAC bans. The only thing you can do is go to Steam Support.
You'd be wrong. They're pretty infrequent, and not one has turned up for Rust, but they do happen. Only one massive fuck-up has happened, where 12,000 MW2 players got banned at once because Steam changed a file after the game launched and then VAC detected that the file had been changed and freaked out.
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Sounds like its time to start saving your allowance again. You can open a support ticket with Steam if you want but bullshit excuses won't work on them. You'll just get an automated copy/paste reply which basically amounts to "tough shit, thanks for the business."
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sounds like god mode is over noob
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Unban process at Facepunch:-
1. Gary holds wallet open.
2. Hacker stuffs in cash until Gary nods.
3. Hacker logs in again (forget to uninstall hack)
4. Gary holds wallet open.
5. Hackers 'little brother' logs into account with leet hax.
6. Etc.
7. Sale of forum popcorn goes up.
8. Hits puberty.
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Post your steam profile
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You're going to have to try to contact Steam regarding this, zoidberg17. The VAC bans have nothing to do with the developers of the game you're banned from, and this is the game-developer's forum—sorry. :(
Don't mind a lot of the responses here. They follow this logic:
Step 1: Assume all VAC bans are accurate.
Step 2: Consider a situation where someone says they've been inaccurately banned.
Step 3: Refer to Step 1. Conclude that this person is lying and, in fact, was cheating.
Step 4: Use your conclusion in Step 3 as evidence for why your assumption in Step 1 is correct.
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All VAC bans are accurate... if they weren't, don't you think there would be a huge shitstorm here? Yet we get only a couple of these a day, and a good 75% of the time, they use the exact same username for cheat sites.
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No, I don't think so. There are two possibilities:AmagicalFishy posted:
- There are inaccurate VAC bans and there isn't a huge shitstorm here.
- There are inaccurate VAC bans and there is a huge shitstorm here.
I don't see reason to assume the second possibility, and then use that assumption to further assume that all VAC bans are accurate. Naturally, some people who are banned (accurately or inaccurately) come here to complain about it—but I don't think that this gives us reason to believe that everyone else who is banned is going to do the same thing. On a similar note, I don't think that infrequent complaints correlates with how accurate VAC bans are. What if VAC bans were 50% accurate, but it only banned a few people from Rust, and even fewer of those people complained here? We don't know anything of accuracy based on the infrequency of complaints.
Also, I, for example, have used the name AmagicalFishy for years. I don't hack, I don't cheat, nor do I condone either, but I have a registered account on www.mpgh.net. If I were to get VAC banned from something, people here would use my account on that site as "evidence" that I hacked. I can also fully understand being active in a "hack filled" community without hacking one's self.
I've seen a lot of how people here treat others who are VAC banned, and it's behavior that's filled with circular assumptions and confirmation bias. A lot of the times, it even seems rather malicious.
(Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying VAC is a bad or inaccurate system, nor am I saying all or most of the complaints here are truthful. I'm just saying that, if someone says "I've been unreasonably banned. I don't cheat!" Assuming guilt and responding with "Well, you shouldn't have cheated!" doesn't actually help anything. It's like assuming someone who was arrested is guilty; they may be most of the time, but the assumption is ultimately a detrimental one.)
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Already checked your account on mpgh Fishy :D thing is there are no posts regarding rust . Almost all of the VAC banned guys that are getting caught having accounts on cheating sites have some questions about the cheat they bought or how come it wasn't "VAC proof" + recent activity . If VAC does a mistake it would be one that would ban so many guys that the forums would explode . He cheated , he got busted now he has to buy the game again and maybe this time he won't cheat .
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AmagicalFishy, what jonny is essentially expressing is this:
I've heard this story hundreds of times since VAC bans started near the beginning of the year. "I got VAC banned, I don't know why, I did nothing wrong, it must've been that bug when I closed the door and got flung into space and kicked by the server for violation. I'm not a cheater, please unban me, I don't know what I did to get banned."
Hundreds of times.
Some people get creative and say that they turned their gamma up in the Nvidia control panel, or that they had mouse macro buttons set up. At the end of the day, the story is still the same. Somehow VAC screwed up and banned them by mistake.
I don't know what the exact number is for Rust VAC bans since the beginning of the year, but it's at least 2,000.
When you contest a VAC ban, the VAC case (i.e. your ban and the data VAC has on you to justify the ban) is reviewed by a human being. If you are incorrectly banned, Steam Support will say as much in the ticket when they unban you.
If VAC is so terrible at this, with these hundreds and hundreds of innocents who've been caught unfairly, why has there not been a single screenshot of a reversed VAC ban for Rust? That seems pretty improbable if it's as unreliable as the hundreds of complainers say it is.
Or maybe there's a more probable explanation: They're lying because lying might get them unbanned and they have nothing to lose by trying.
Also, nobody on FP can unban you anyway.
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Mezamorphis—if someone with the same profile name is asking for Rust hacks... well... that's pretty obvious incriminating evidence, haha. Though, I've seen a lot of cases where it's "Oh, a profile name similar to yours is talking about hacks, so you're a hacker!" These are the cases I'm talking about.
elixwhitetail, there are 4 groups of people who are VAC banned from Rust.
- People who did not cheat and who contacted Steam.
- People who did cheat and who contacted Steam.
- People who did not cheat and came to Facepunch forums.
- People who did cheat and came to Facepunch forums.
The only data we have available to us is the combined number of the last two groups. That is, people who either did or did not cheat and came to Facepunch forums. Personally, if I was VAC banned from a game, I would contact Steam. When that ban is revoked, the last thing I would think of is "I should take a screenshot of this." The very last thing I would think of is "I should go to the developer forums and post my screenshot."
In order to see a screenshot of a reversed VAC ban for Rust, you'd have to appeal to a pretty small subset of people: Those people who did not cheat and came to Facepunch forums, who then contacted Steam, got their ban revoked, and decided to screenshot it and post it on Facepunch. Now that's what seems pretty improbable.
Let's consider, now, a person in this small subset. Said person probably doesn't know much about hacking or why they get banned (exemplified by the fact that they come to the Facepunch forums after getting banned instead of contacting Steam). What if, after thinking of why they might have been banned, the only thing they can think of is "Well, I did glitch through a door. I bet that's why!"
I understand that some (probably most) people are lying, and that VAC is probably pretty accurate—but this does not justify the pretty awful behavior towards people who are banned, no more than it justifies spitting on someone who was arrested and asking for help just because they were arrested.
There are so many factors that we're ignorant of, making too many assumptions is... well, bad, and doesn't really help anyone, anywhere, even that small subset of people who did not cheat and come to Facepunch .
Edited:
Sorry, 4 groups of people who are VAC banned and try to get unbanned. I'm not sure how many people get banned and say "Whelp, fuck it" for whatever reason, and either buy a new copy or just don't bother playing anymore.
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Are you fucking dense? Go research how VAC works, there are NO false positives, and on the EXTREMELY rare offchance there is, it is reversed.
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I know how VAC works. As I've said, I don't think it's an inaccurate system by any means. This does not make the behavior of which I speak any more reasonable. My comments were independent of how VAC works—so that suggestion is kind of silly.
I... assume you didn't actually read what you quoted?
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So...you don't think VAC is inaccurate but you're saying being VAC banned isn't evidence of cheating.
A VAC ban in and of itself *IS* the evidence. Unless, you have an example of some people who were wrongly VAC banned from Rust. I mean, with all these "false" bans there must be dozens of examples.
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There's a lot of trolling here, that's why.
The helpful answer to all of these "false positive" threads would be to contact Steam Support.
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Funnily enough, I said it twice in this thread for OP's benefit.
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A VAC ban is no more evidence of cheating than being arrested is evidence of doing something wrong. When considering whether or not the ban was just, it is not reasonable to say "Well, other bans are just so yours must be, too."
The problem in lies here:
The evidence for VAC being an accurate system is if the accounts VAC bans are cheating.
In other words, the circle is this:
- VAC is accurate. The evidence for this is that, when you have a cheat, it detects it.
- You have a cheat and VAC detected it. The evidence for this is that VAC is accurate.
VAC being accurate is synonymous with someone having a cheat and VAC detecting it. One is not evidence for the other—they are both the same thing. Effectively, when people say "You had a cheat and VAC detected it because VAC is accurate" and "VAC is accurate because it detects when people have cheats," they are saying "VAC is accurate because VAC is accurate."
While VAC being accurate may be true, someone being banned by VAC is not evidence for them cheating, because then it would be evidence for VAC being accurate (because it bans cheaters).
All the people who go around saying "There've never been any false positives, so you are a cheater" are also the people who very well may have blown off false positives because they think there are no false positives.
Does that make sense? Describing circular logic is sometimes kind of convoluted.
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Wouldn't you classify cheating, being banned and then coming to the Facepunch forums, lying about what you did and asking to be unbanned as "trolling" too?
"Contact Steam support." is an answer, yes...but not one that's gonna help them. In fact, if you think about it "Contact Steam" usually is the troll reply because everyone here already knows what Steam is gonna tell them which is basically, "thanks for the money."
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There have been several people who have claimed to not have cheated who also claimed to have contacted Steam.
This means the only data we have is from all four groups. As by assuming that they aren't lying that they did not cheat we must also assume they contacted Steam.
The first post negates the second. If you understood how VAC works, than you would know why there is no one who did not cheat and got VAC banned.
VAC is activated when a program modifies they running code, modified files, changes in memory locations. There are no false positives in the detection of these. In computing it either is or isn't. False positives are created by the interpretation of these detections. As there are approved 3rd party programs they have to have a process to determine the difference between them vs an unapproved program.
It should be noted that a recent batch of false positives were reversed for Counter-Strike: Global Offensive players in February of this year.
With 20k - 40k players playing at any given point, it would be reasonable to say the sort of claims that cause the false bans are not unique. In fact, many of the claims are fairly common occurrences. So logically it would be expected to see that like occurrences would yield like results. As the detection of whatever triggered their ban would not be limited to just them, we should see a mass of players reporting similar outcomes.
And this has been the trend!
When the first VAC wave hit, a mass of players came on and reported getting banned falsely.
When the cheatpunch wave hit, a mass of players came on and reported getting banned falsely.
And I predict when the EAC wave hits, a mass of players came on and reported getting banned falsely.
So if an issue arose, causing a false positive, it is reasonable to assume the trend would continue, a mass of players coming on and reported getting banned falsely. If it were indeed true, and reproducible, it would be fixed and bans reversed.
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How many vac banned accounts do you own AmagicalFishy? There is only one groups that keeps harping on VAC bans...
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I think his whole point in a nutshell was that it's rather unnecessary to be so overwhelmingly hostile and toxic towards people who make these posts.
While it's understandable why people would be hostile towards these posts, it also bring out some toxicity that is well....quite toxic.
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That's like telling people they should be helpful and polite to robbers.
Cheaters come here to complain about being banned, remorseless after having ruined the game for other players and expect to bullshit their way out of being banned so they can go back to cheating. Not only that but even worse...they don't bother to read the section rules pinned at the top of this forum otherwise they wouldn't make these dumb threads. So, who are the real trolls here?
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Many times someone does in fact post that the only thing the "victim" can do is contact Steam Support with regards to VAC. Sometimes people take it a step further and link to Steam Support. 9 times out of 10 the "victim" seems to ignore this, preferring to continue to try and get someone here to undo the ban.
Maybe they think if they convince someone here to do it that it will be instant, maybe they know they are guilty and that contacting Steam Support won't help. We may never know.
I am also fairly certain that if anyone had actually succeeded in getting a VAC ban in Rust undone that they would have come back here to show us. Some as a "thanks guys, I got it sorted out", a majority as "read it and weep, assholes!!1". You can feel the way you did the last time I pointed that out, I feel this is what would happen based on how most of the "victims" have reacted to the situation.
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There were a lot of posts; I'm not going to reply to each of them individually (that would be a mess), but I'll sum up the key points of what I've said prior:
- Someone being banned by VAC is not evidence that they are cheating (this post)
- There's need for the (as Epsilo put it) toxic behavior when these threads are made.
Also, it isn't true that, many of the times the person ignores someone who suggests "contact Steam" as if it wasn't said. What usually happens is someone makes a thread saying they were banned and they did not cheat. Amongst the torrents of insults, snide comments, "show me your profile," and internet detective work, someone might say "We can't help you. Contact Steam," then the OP spends the rest of the thread defending his/her self.
Yes, I know how VAC works. Posting quotes and videos that say "VAC is accurate" does not actually address anything. I know VAC is accurate. This does not matter when someone claims an instance of VAC being inaccurate (above posts address this).
Did the explanation of the circle in logic help express my point, IGotWorms?
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We get it, you can stop saying the same thing over again now
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I think you've misinterpreted what I meant. What I meant by "What usually happens is someone makes a thread saying they were banned and they did not cheat," is that the person who makes the thread says they were banned and they also say that they did not cheat.
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1) send your steam profile to us
2) prepare your wallet to savior garry
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True enough, however the level of toxicity over hackers, who may be a hacker, who is a hacker, people who defend them etc, is a bit of a nuisance, and serves only to cause problems.
The thread has already started along the lines of a hacker witch-hunt, where anyone taking any stance opposed to flaming a hacker, despite their intentions, are considered hackers, etc.
Not necessarily you, or particular others, but it's the direction threads tend to take, and it's a horse that's been beat to death a millionth time.
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And of course the OP never responds again after someone asks for his steam account for a bit of a background check.
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He's probably sleeping.
In the basement.
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Being banned is not an arrest. It's being tried and convicted.
Get your analogies straight.
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::grabs more popcorn::
Ha! Each one of these ALWAYS comes through for our entertainment!
Funny x 12
Dumb x 5
Optimistic x 3
Disagree x 1
Agree x 6
Zing x 1
x 1
Artistic x 1
Late x 4
Useful x 1
Informative x 1
