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Hey everyone,
I been running a server for a few weeks without doing a wipe unless I absolutely need to. I'm already at 19,000 objects.
I was wondering from other server owners how many objects Rust can handle before a server becomes unplayable?
Thanks :)
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That's a good question though,i really would like to hear the answer(s).
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I'm also wondering how much the server hardware affects the maximum amount of objects. Is it solved by just allocating more RAM? Or is it a CPU issue?
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Some people make way too big buildings. Makes huge laggspikes for others
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After a couple of days of unacceptable lag on my server I contact HFB (yes, I know they aren't the most liked, but I havent had any problems with them)... Less than 6 hours after putting in my ticket I got this:
in part:
"Another cause could be that there are just to many structures (the current limit is around 50k where you start to see issues). Please keep in mind that each base/home has several items built into it and you can easily reach this seemingly high limit in no time."
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From what I understood, map items are stored in a local SQL database.
Performance wise, it is safe to assume that 19k objects in a database does not have a huge impact. Of course, it highly depends of how the objects are stored, cached and queried.
It could probably go to the million and still work well.
When maps will grow larger, and when people will spread, there will be even more items.
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Accessing the database of items present likely isn't the issue. You can run into hundreds of thousands, or even millions of records before you start seeing any performance difference, assuming simple query structure (I don't know the database structure of items in Rust, so that number could be far lower). The "lag" is the client trying to download the requested items from the server over the network and then render them for the player.
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I run a creative server and I wipe roughly every 24-48 hours because of the sheer amount of objects that get built quickly. I can probably give you a strong idea of the limits. I'll take a look at taking some measurements and see if I can give you some actual figures to go on. At the least, here is the graph for our creative server to give you some idea of how quickly things build.
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That CPU is ridiculous. I have jumps around 15%, but I usually stay near 5%, and that's with 13k objects. That must be an insane object count.
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We have about 26 kits with people constantly spawning kits and items to work on builds so we have a much higher rate. Even then though, everything runs very smoothly since I actively monitor and wipe it when needed. It's a more extreme circumstance but I think it goes to show some of the higher limits well.
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From what I heard from the owners of populated servers, once you reach like 40-50k structures, the game becomes unplayable, and that usually happens within 10 days on populated servers.
This is the main reason why wipes happen so often. Forced wipes.
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Thanks for the graphs! When you get a chance could you so a save.all and tell me how many objects are on your server before you do a wipe?
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Right at this moment this is what we have 21,226 object. I wiped the server at 9:00am this morning so all of those have been placed since then (it is 14:41 now, so about 20,000 objects in 5 hours).
These are the current charts for that time. In the hourly you can see how it's steadily built up. On the daily the huge drop is when I wiped the server. We only encountered some slight legginess when we hit 140% so I'm sure we can go a bit longer before it gets really terrible. I usually like to wipe it often anyways to keep it running smoothly. Hope this gives you some insight.
Hourly
Daily
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Hey thanks for getting back to me jediaelthewis and posting more server info.
Here is some feedback from my server:
I created my server on Feb. 21
Peak hours I have about 20~25 players on (that's when you see the ram usage go up)
Currently my server has 19,595 objects on it.
My CPU usage is WAY less than yours (but that's probably because different hardware / host?) OR maybe its the nature of the objects being built? My server would have many more doors / storage's / stashes because it's survival. Your server would have much higher towers and larger buildings.
Your RAM usage seems similar with mine.
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It's unfortunate that no one has chimed in on the true limitation. It's not CPU or Memory you're going to have to worry about in the long run at this time. The default Unity game engine is shit at handling a heavy amount of vectored objects. You can put Rust on an e-3270 96MB Ram beast of a machine, running just one instance of Rust and you will still see extreme rubberbanding around the 35-38k object mark and the server will crash at 50k objects. The limitation isn't hardware, it's the software rendering on the game engine. This engine wasn't designed by someone like Carmack, it was designed for smaller, quickly made games that don't have huge vectored 3d object images everywhere.
Granted, Unity has come a long, long way in it's lifetime. There have been thousands of improvements, tweaks, and add-ins made to the codebase. It's a truly great project and has a great deal of potential. That being said, if you aren't rewriting or heavily modifying the graphics engine you aren't going to be able to sustain a world such as Rust when you have 80 players on for an extended period of time spawning thousands of objects into the world. It's just not possible in the default configuration.
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As someone who is in love with Rust and who doesn't understand anything about programming, it makes me depressed. Does it mean we won't ever be able to run servers which go beyond the 50k objects mark having a decent playability?
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No, it means that the game is still in very early development and things will change over the next couple years.
Be patient, things will get better.
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Not a problem! I figure since you are looking for the limit, the info for my server would give you the best idea of the extremes since we have anywhere up to 30+ people spawning kits and items in at once.
I have another update actually. I planned to wipe the server this morning but I found out it crashed last night once it reached a certain limit. Unfortunately I was not able to get ab object count but my estimation was about 50,000 objects or so before it crashed. Mind you that's quite a lot of building.
Here is the graph:
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I am guessing that with time they may have other ways of optimizing the server software. One way would be to let server owners split the map into quadrants. Run 4 servers, one per quadrant, and allow the servers to hand people from one server to the next in realtime. (see Ultima Online circa:1996) In UO you had a bit of rubberbanding lag when you were handed off to the next server, but everyone knew where server lines were and expected it. That one change would allow item count to go up roughly 4x.
Ultima Online had population of 150,000 across 21 server farms around 1999-2000, and you could build custom homes from items in that game also. The way they fixed the issue with loading lag was to have the client store what buildings last looked like. Each time you entered an area it would load any changes made to the buildings on the fly in the background instead of loading the whole building. They made it work and we were on 33.6k and 56k dialup mostly back then.
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