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Post #41Interesting that none of you even mentioned the fact that safe zones may backfire horribly.
As an equipped, established and KOS-player (which i'm not ;) ), on a a server with a safe zone, i would build my base just outside the zone and wait for people to leave it and then take all the stuff they gathered in complete safety.
Thats a raiders DREAM!! once people figure this out: have fun dealing with a ring of bases around the zone! and why should i even try to kill equipped people when all the stuff i need i can get from naked people trying to "start" the game by leaving the zone? much too risky!
just my 2 cents
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Also this^
My preference is rare non-craftable military weapons, craftable rare C4 and loot tables that include resources and less rare metal building supplies.
Considering that future plans include the removal of military weapons I really like this. Actually saw two people having a Hand Cannon fight.
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Uh.. seems your main problem is your building a shack, have your tried building a 1x1 foundation house? lol. You never-ever make a shack first, unless it's an emergency.
Id get some more hours in the game first. There's right ways to do things, and wrong ways.
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You know, to be honest, there should atleast be an option for admins to implement PvE only, for certain areas. Some servers want to be softcore beginner friendly, and it should be an option for admins to administrate, but which wouldn't be as vanilla.
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Unless I'm mistaken Oxide has that feature, to specify certain areas PVP zones....
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Really dude? You couldn't think of ANY better way to say this? No one should be ashamed for talking about a game. Learn how to disagree without being a complete assclown and alienating people from wanting to play.
"In Conclusion:"
-Don't ever use the words "beg" or "cry" try to argue your point. You can do better.
- If you actually want to convince someone to your point of view, turn up the logic, turn down the nerdrage.
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I started the game as a lone wolf, because my understanding was everyone you meet will kill you. I learned that to be false later but in my first playthrough I found the road, found where good resources spawn and built a hidden shack in the mountains.
After I found out that people arent all bad I built a house on the road and built a tower to harass people from, kinda like a checkpoint where I shoot at everyones feet and demand they tell me who they are and why they are here and what is 2009*4067, who was estonias first democratically elected president.
Did all this 100% solo, sure my server isnt super populated but there are usually 30/50 and usually at least 5-10 bandits on at any given time. I think i have a very comfortable rust life, 1 hidey-hole, 1 house, i know how to craft nades and m4. and like i said i didnt live in the community with anyone else when I did all this, I think its fun to communicate with your neighbors but it is in no way required.
It's kinda harsh to say but maybe the people whining are just not playing correctly. Your guide is good, and your guide isn't the only one people have put out there that have really good advice. Noobs need to learn it's ok to die a few times as you learn how to play and that you need to play smarter. It isn't about how much stuff you have, I've killed bandits with kevlar and m4's when all I had was a shitty revolver. Those well equipped bandits stood in the road like fish in a barrel while I zig-zagged when I ran and hid in the mountains to ambush after the line of sight was broken. In no way do more experienced players have some kind of uber advantage over new one. Saying, "Baw I have a rock you have a m4" is not a real issue. Are the noobs saying I DIDN'T start out with a rock and earn my m4?
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Hit reply and had a brain fart...
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I gave constructive comments after on how to improve his over all game play experience, but I for one am tired of the EXCESSIVE hand holding / Safe Zones in games. Like I said in the rest of my reply we have a very unique open FREE world atm. Maybe you like socialism I don't know? I for one don't. He also stated that he did extensive research on the game prior to purchase. So this isn't a case of not knowing what he was stepping into, but very poetically created a whine thread.
In Conclusions:
- It comes back to the premiss of trying to get the devs to restrict everyone's freedom in the game. So which is more ignorant, my comments? Or someone trying to force their will on everyone?
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y'all postin in a bait thread
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The OP made comments, and included suggestions, in a very civil and polite way... More than I can say for most of the responses.... In no way was he trying to force anything... If anything all the raging people calling him out are trying to force playing how YOU want onto him.
But just a question, and it's an honest question... How would a safe zone restrict everyone's freedom? Again, I have not mentioned for or against this, just trying to get a decent conversation out of this, instead of the lame single word "no", or the rude "go play something else" replies.....
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Your comments. I also don't think there should ever be safe zones, just like you. But I'm not so insecure about my stance on it (or e-peen) that I have to attack and shame the OP, rather than just discussing my reasons why. Convince him, don't berate him.
In Conclusion:
-Having an opinion is not "forcing your will on everyone".
-Grow up.
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Read my post above, safe zones would mostly restrict the freedom of the weak, not the strong.
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First off I will admit my first paragraph was crass and quick off the gun, but after 14 years of seeing this crap creep into games, my patience for it has run low. So I will apologize to the OP if he took offense to it.
Secondly myself and others are not trying to FORCE him to play our way, we are simply trying to keep the game the way it is, the way the developers currently made it. If developers wanted "Safe" zones in a survival game I think they would of put them in(As silly as that is). The developers created a very harsh environment where players play and create their own rules right out of the gate. The biggest part of the survival isn't worrying about the animals or zombies, its worrying about the other players! This is what gives the game the Rush that everyone loves. This type of freedom in a game is very unique and hasn't been done properly in YEARS.
To answer your question: If they hard coded safe zones into the game it takes away everyone's freedom of choice. The choice that if two people spawn naked with a rock and one wants to smash the others head in with the rock, they no longer have this choice. Its the freedom of choice that truely makes this game and gives it that special adrenaline rush. Put safe zones in and that is taken away. Ohhh I don't have to worry about death because i'm in a safe zone. Ohhh i'm being chased I'll just run until I hit a safe zone and I will be safe. It would just take away from the atmosphere of the game. Also if it was hard coded in people who didn't want that would have to mod it out as EVERY server would be effected, unlike the way it is now. As it is now if you want to play a certain way that is not the main stream you mod your server to do so but it doesn't effect everyone. So everyone is happy :)
Lastly it has been proven over and over again that safe zones just get abused by raiders and noobs alike. Noobs will just run to the safe zone whenever in trouble and raiders will just build their towers surrounding the safe zones to grief the lowbies.
The best way is to leave it up to the players and let them create their own protection by grouping together to overcome things.
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And I Completely agree with your post, I saw it happen on a continuous basis when I played WarZ... I was just wondering if Rusty had any actual reasons, or just like all these other people and wants to disagree to disagree..... Because that's the way THEY want it, screw anyone else..
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Yes. See, this is what we need more of. Thoughtful discussion.
Now again, remember, I agree with you that there should be no safe zones. However, I want to touch on something you said "the biggest part of survival isn't xyz, its other players". Is that the way it should be? Why isn't CoD considered a survival game? Should the environment play a bigger role in the danger in addition to other players?
I think it should, so I just wanted to see what you think.
edit: Rusty i hope you don't leave before seeing this post
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Do an experiment for me, and look on how many OPEN world sandbox pvp games started off with total freedom, no safe zones and actually launched like that or stayed like that in the last 15 years. When I say games I also don't mean straight up FPS's like BF4 ect. You will be hard pressed to find more then 2. You will see where my frustration comes from :P Over the years I have seen many games, kickstarts, and projects start off like Rust and turn into a safe zone poloza due to people crying because they get shot down all the time. Eventually the dev's cave because they want to adhere to a bigger demographic leaving the people who want that harsh experience in the lurch for the next lingering hope :(
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Thank you!!! To an extend, a large extent I agree with everything... But I do also agree with Haxer that the environment should play an equal role... Now getting that balance is another thing... I'm glad that isn't my job ;) ;)
Sorry to bust your balls man, but if every thread would get this kind of responce, can you imagine how us, as a community would be better ;) ;) I may be new to Rust, and this forum.. But like many of you here, I have been gaming for a very, very long time... And visiting game forums for a long time as well, and they always end up being the same, would like to see something different for a change ;) ;)
For what it's worth, I appreciate the effort you took, you sound much smarter and knowledgable in this light ;) ;)
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This has been said more than once already but seems to have been largely ignored...there ARE servers already with PVP limited to certain times, events and/or specific areas.
To anyone who says, "You can't tell me how to play!" while telling someone else how NOT to play, the statement itself is laden with irony. I didn't see where OP stated that PVE zones should be mandatory on all servers. If it's an option...what's wrong with options? And again as has been pointed out...there are already servers with PVP restricted to certain zones/areas/times/etc. At the moment, that is handled and enforced by active moderators.
If there was a way to designate an area where players would be unable to hurt each other or "FF:OFF" as it were and also as a no build area, I don't see a problem with that for server owners who want that option.
If OP is suggesting that NO PVP zones be mandatory for every server then that of course is silly but that's not the way I read it.
OP's second suggestion about implementing a level system and then limiting killing to level ranges does seem ridiculous though.
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Thanks and I Agree about the community, always helps when the community can have a good discussion on things. The whole safe zone thing is just a red button for me. The second you start seeing that creep into the forums its like that girl you've been dating for a few weeks and you start seeing those red flags pop up, just sends shivers down your spine as you've seen it a thousand times before and you know where its heading yet do nothing, despite better judgement :p
Edited:
Oh don't get me wrong, if the dev's want to bake in options that are tog-gable for different things for those who host servers more power to you. What I have a problem with is when the game in large changes for everyone due to people complaining to change it that way.
Knowing how modular Rust is I probably should of known better, but you just never know, and history has a terrible way of repeating its self.
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The way I see it is this...
If the devs are worried about the money, and want to please everyone, it will be implemented.... Casuals bring more money in than other players, there are more of them....
If the devs have the cajones to stick to what they want to do, then we might see a pretty damn good game come out of this ;) Community feedback is always a good thing to listen to, but in the bigger picture, it is their game, and they know where they want to go with it... I want to see a game maker have what it takes to make a game without getting pressured by the noobs, casuals, hardcore, elite, ect......
I really don't have any pros or cons as to safe zones, besides the griefing that happens near them... I wouldn't go near it personally ;) For me it's a personal choice, I just don't have the need for it... But I'm not anyone to tell others that they can't.....
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On the Firefall forums I was one of the few players advocating PVP regions...
Lets step back and look at the pros and cons of having some safe starter zones within a pvp world.
Now I know these areas cant be too resource rich and cant have too much storage or you will have groups powering up in the safe areas and then rushing pvp bases. Lets say the safe zone only has the most basic gear and players have only a small safe storage in that area.
What does this accomplish? For starters, other players cant invade your hovel and steal your everything while you are at work or asleep.
Yes that means some players will loose the thrill of hammering sleeping players with rocks but is it such a big loss?
Next, when a player dies, he might have a bit of equipment left in that small storage. So being killed doesn't mean the loss of everything. That also means gunning down fewer naked guys. I personally wouldn't mind fewer naked guys running around.
Finally, something for the PVPers - I know many of you see safe zones as areas where carebears frolic and moon the real hardcore players from behind their gates but remember - they have to come outside sometime. Getting the good gear, building the best e.peen of a fortress still requires taking some risk.
Even better, there will be more of these players to shoot at. The frustrations of being killed while asleep and gunned down while naked keep players away from the game. Add a way to ease into the PVP side of things and I think you will find more targets running around.
A safe zone would very likely improve the quality of your PVP rather than ruin it.
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This isnt WoW my comrade.
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I agree but you can only get kevlar/powerful guns/big medkits from three locations:
1. Rad town boxes
2. zombies
3. air drops
When there is a large powerful clan by each of the rad town/zombie locations then anyone starting new in the server will have a very hard time being able to get the items that the large clans have. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Cloth armor + hand canon + no medkits < kevlar + m4 + medkits.
It's not fun getting hopelessly outgunned and outnumbered and outarmored and out mekitted when you try to run to a rad town to get a shotgun blueprint or try to kill a zombie siletently at night with a bow to try to get a research kit.
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i also wanna have tab-target, floating name plates,world map, minimap and locked backpacks.
ohh wait??!?!?!
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Nice to see the constructive part of the thread is over, kids must be getting out of school....
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this thread is destructive on the core gameplay.
its only constructive to get more money from them casuals.
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I think this is a good idea if it's something the players themselves decide. Once we have the tools in the game to implement such a thing, I say we should do it. Have turrets with an option to shoot ANYONE who attacks someone else, including the creator of the turret.
Have "contracts" that players can voluntarily enter into that make them subject to rules set in the contract (such as adhering to a reputation system). Give players the tools and let us decide what's best for us.
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And your attitude is destructive to the community. There has to be some compromises, you do realize there are more ot "them casuals" than hardcore/leet/competitive/whatever gamers ..... But you don't really give a crap about anyone elses opinions but your own, or those that agree with you, isn't that about right?
I don't really agree with a set safe zone, but i'm open to discuss options instead of trolling..... The CORE gameplay is to survive, any way you can... Not go around KOSing everyone you see... How is that survival? That nekked guy that logged on the server for the first time 2 minutes ago is a huge threat isn't he?
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I think you should go back and play WOW my friend. This is a hardcore game not for carebears. I am tired of people coming on Rust and crying about dying. I have been murdered on Rust maybe 600 times. I never give up and throw in the towel... I get smarter. Now for like 8 hours of gaming I die maybe once.
You just need to learn how to play the game properly. Don't tell me you know how to play it properly if you are sad about being ganked when you have the mighty wooden shack. lol.
Yeah but seriously, Rust is different because it doesn't have safe zones and stupid levels.
Please go back to WOW.
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Please, no safezones..if you have played any "survival" game with safezones youll know they are pointless. Only thing its added to the games ive played with SZ's, are campers and griefers. we have enough of those already
Pvp zones should be doable, but up to the server owner as to where and how they function(if at all). the only time i see a pvp zone being viable is having like a PVE server with an arena or something, and inside the ring its PVP(could host duels/tournaments n such). if it was just a section of the map that you can walk to and once you get to a certain part its PVP, kids would just farm in the pve sections.
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Damn skippy! Rust isn't for Carebears! Just take a look at some of the most popular servers in Rust are advertising...
Kevlar/M4s/Airdrop Donation kits, Instacraft, No Sleepers, No Fall Damage, No C4 Crafting, Super Starter Kit, Raid Alerts, Economy plugins so you can buy building materials instead of harvesting for hours, days, weeks, etc.
Server admins that have godmode and can spawn whatever they want, kick/ban whoever they want and whenever they want because they paid for it dammit! Tired of server admins who abuse their power? Just rent a server...and then you can abuse your power!
Got killed by someone? Just respawn at your house, grab a gun and get some payback! Are they hiding in their fortress? Wait until they're offline then raid them!
But...this game is definitely not for Carebears.
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Go back to WarZ
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never go full-derp, bro...
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I keep trying to rate this thread as dumb, but cant' because I've already voted. This has happened twice now.
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Nah, I don't want anything like that imposed. I just want a sandbox and be able to do what I please in it, not for someone to split it up and force me to abide to a particular set of rules.
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If you want safe zones, feel free to play any of the other numerous games that support that type of playstyle.
This is a sandbox, based entirely around the threat of other players as the main factor. Open world pvp with player looting simply isn't for everyone, and this is one of those times.
The absolute best course of action is for you to move on to another game that supports the (carebear) playstyle you seem to prefer, rather than attempting to transform Rust into something it isn't.
Players like this have been ruining good sandbox games for over a decade, just stop.
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^ THIS. READ THIS.
I don't play Eve. But I heard there is a "safe zone" in there where people trade. But that turned out to be a "war zone" instead.
Safe zone only bring bigger problem. You will never be able to walk outside as everyone have their sniper scope on the exit.
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If you want to play a safer server, go PvE server, + no sleeper if you don't want to get killed while logout but yo will be raided no matter what. Otherwise sorry this game not suit unless learn to adapt.
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Majority of the map is a giant safe zone already, PvP zone is acually very small - few rad towns and the road. Set you compass to north - run 15mins, welcome to safe zone.
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Yeah, you don't...play EVE that is. That's entirely different. It's called "suicide ganking" and it absolutely doesn't apply to this discussion.
To break it down simply there are low/high security systems that are patrolled by NPC ships. If you attack another player in one of these systems, the NPC ships will respond and kill you. If players spot a valuable target in a low/high sec system, they or a fleet will attack the target with disposable ships and destroy it. They will get destroyed in the process as well. One of their alts, who did not participate in the attack will go and pick up the loot from the ship they destroyed if they were successful.
There are no peace enforcing NPCs in Rust hence there is no correlation.
Agree x 2
Informative x 1
Disagree x 1
Dumb x 1
Late x 1
Optimistic x 1
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