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Post #1http://i.imgur.com/aaP80dH.jpg
So i spent some time during the past 4 weeks, drawing and playing architect every now and then. I did some proper calculations on various designs, and this turned out to be the absolute most efficient in terms of wood/metal spent per unit of safety. By unit of safety, i mean per C4 that HAS to be used.
Some explanation: The design is based on a 100% "Grief-Proof" system, where the only way to the top floor (Where the loot is) is from the ground up (Of course you can blow yourself in through the 2nd floor walls, etc)
The outermost foundations that go all the way around, are nothing but foundations with a midpillar reaching all the way up, and 1-2 stories ABOVE the top floor.
The 2nd outermost foundations that go all the way around, are foundations with edgepillars and midpillars all the way to the highest floor, where you will place ceilings ontop, in order to create a "ceiling-cap" The ceiling cap with midpillars underneath, combined with the outermost midpillars all the way up and beyond the tallest floor, creates a system where no one can build stairs or jump ontop of the roof, and jump onto pillars in order to reach any floor above the 2nd floor.
This design essentially means that someone could blow into the 2nd floor, where the stair to the 3rd floor is located, and thus bypass the 1st and 2nd floor entirely. From the 3rd floor, and all the way up, to as many floors as you'd like to add, one HAS to go through 4 metal doors. This means that 8 floors = 20 Metal Doors minimum, 9 = 24, 10 = 28 and so on.
The numbers and calculations on the picture are based on an 8 floor building.
Feel free to discuss!
EDIT: IMPORTANT - Browse through the comments and you'll find that this design is indeed flawed. However, it is elaborated on how to make it entirely secure with a few adjustments in the comment section below.
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Not a bad design for something that is doable for 1-2 players. But if you have a group of 6-7 friends you can build a bigger and more complex base.
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One thing... Wouldn't someone be able to just simply make another platform, build staircases all the way up, set down ceiling towards where they want to walk across, and just form staircases down over your roof, and essentially defeat the purpose of this building?
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Well the base has 80 metal doors so they need to spend quite allot of C4 if they want to raid every room.
The placement of pillars stop them from being able to place stairs that close anyway. However there are no base that can never prevent some one from raiding it. You just have to make them think twice about how much resources they have to spend to loot the resources that might be inside.
PS: What the hell the blue print does not say anything about the metal doors just he door ways. If you don't place a metal door in every door way it sucks.
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You can't put a ceiling where there is a midpillar. There are midpillars covering every single square of space in a 2x square radius of the entire main-building (the innermost 2x4 red marked squares). There is absolutely no way to create anything but pillars. The only thing that can be placed are more pillars, of which you can't physically get to the wall itself by jumping on. I have tested this ingame.
Edited:
If you have 6-7 friends and want a more complex / secure base, the answer is simple: Build higher. There is no limit other than the actual sky-limit that prevents you from building this further upwards. Potentially you could have 40 floors and be secure behind 150 metal doors if you'd like. If you mean that you want a wider base, there is absolutely no point in it. It takes you just as long to walk through all the doors upwards as if you were to walk more horizontally, as the space between each doorway ingame is the same. The current stance of the game makes it so that "more doors = more safety", so long as you have 100% anti-grief.
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Well what you can do (not sure how effective it is though but some have to fall for it) Is to leave some of the center rooms without floors/ceilings but have doors that you are forced to jump owner to get to the next level. At least some player will fall down and die if its high enough.
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And guys that is the reason servers lags: Because people build motherships instead of house.
I am the only guy who doesn't care about safety, just fun and builds house like...3x4x2(or3 floor)? With some window, place to put my chair and take a rest, shoot enemies when they are coming and get raided my shit?
I mean, how much time will take you to farm that? For what servers are? Populated or not? Because is harder to make bigger structures at populated servers, if they are wiped and you start from begining it's ok and you have a chance, if not it will take you a lot of time.
I am playing a server that has been wiped 6 days ago, actually have a lot of lag were you get back every time: The main reason of that it's because people has build big structures like 4x4 with 30 floors in just 5 days, plus some foundations around big-mothership and infinite pilars. Server have max cap of 250 players so I am thinking that server is going to be wipped in less than 14 days by the lag.
Conclusion: You can do two things in Rust: play & have a social life or play & don't have a social life. Just build for fun and not to be the best player in Rust, lol.
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I think I know how this base is designed but I can't quite know what it looks like ingame. I really would like to build this base because it seems really secure. Could you post some more screenshots either ingame or create a video on it?
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Interesting. I found the key to my success is to make a tower with hundreds of metal doors and a maze of dead ends and stairways. After they waste about 20 C4 blowing their way into empty rooms, they will eventually just give up. I also just leave crates with stone around to piss them off.
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I would fill all the pillar spots, rather than just the middle - for one reason:
Currently you can place a pillar, then place an angled barricade on it. Then another pillar... and another angled barricade on that one... all the way to the top floor, and barricade-walk/jump up, and use C4 to blast into the top floor's walls - getting the whole cache for one C4 if you're lucky, two if the wall is very new.
Now, admittedly, placing them all correctly, and barricade hopping itself isn't super easy - but I've seen several houses on my server raided using this method, because they though a mid-pillar was safe enough.
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lol. I hope they introduce some physics to the 80 Floor Wooden CN Tower buildings I keep seeing in Rust.
I wanna see some towers crashing down from a small wind breeze.
~ C
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I have the same design on my desk. I prefer to start out with this kind of building.
This design is a good way to protect your stuff. But it not necessary the safest way.
On this design.
Unless you fill every room with crates you are better of with just 1 row. You save a lot of materials and can build higher and they have to use more c4. 2 wide is only effective if you can get people to blow every wall on the way up. if they dont see crates they will not do that. I have seen people raiding this kind of building when you only have 2 foundations with pillars. They were able to get in at the 3rd floor. I now use 2,5 foundation on each side now and have yet to be able to get in that high when I raid my own house :P
I have seen people raiding this kind of building when you only have 2 fondations with pillars. they were able to get in at the 3rd floor. I use 2,5 foundation on each side now and have yet to be able to get in that high when I raid my own house :P
Keeping your stuff safe.
Keeping your stuff safe is a lot more complex thing. You can not protect everything. But I keep a few "small stash" in good location to store anything I at that I feel I can not easily replace. I have been raided by large groups that carry loads of c4. But so far all my hidden places have been safe. I never keep more then a few c4 in my house. If someone use 60 c4 to get your stuff and they find 40+ c4 most of your building was useless.
Imho: Best way to keep something safe is to hide it. Never ever keep loads of c4 in any kind of building.
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hmm....
approaching this as an amateur raider (in that I've never raided anyone but have tried to predict their approach when building for myself)
stair way outside of the build area to highest point on pillars, build walls between pillars up to the nearest wall on house... balance on walls (doable with wood, i do it a lot when building..., not sure on metal walls) c4 through wall... then cost of c4 to access individual rooms.
It's a tight design, certainly off putting to a lot of raiders, but not impregnable. For a small group it's not a bad design, and easily achievable, though I suspect that going a little wider and lower would give you a much more secure "core" area at the cost of a little height.
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Thank you for the feedback folks, i've come to realize that you do in fact need to fill both the outermost and the 2nd outermost layer of foundations with pillars on _EVERY_ slot, as well as build everything outside the ceiling cap 1-2 stories taller than the ceiling cap itself. This way, there is no possibility of anyone building anything what so ever in between or ontop of any of those pillars.
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Edited:
How is it grief proof
brb knocking down your wood stairs in 15 hits and putting a wood ceiling then lol'ing out of there
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its not grief proof. they can destroy your stairs and put a ceiling there.
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What i meant by "grief-proof" is not the "douchebag griefing" where you put ceilings etc. But the cheesy methods where you use stairs and crates / barricades etc to enter through the top floor.
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Someone had a base like this.
I outsmarted the idea, took me an hour to figure out.
Due to the offset beams, I couldnt build stairs, ramps, doors an what not.
But you can still build walls. You can also walk on top of walls.
So I built stairs on the outer side of the foundation.
Placed Walls up.
Jumped Acrossed Them
Looted and destroyed. 10 C4 charges later
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sorry, this isn't "the perfect design". there is a design which can not be raided even with an infinite amount of C4. there's a thread about it in this forum somewhere, i'm too lazy to find it. the basic concept of the unraidable house is that it's bordered completely by pillars and has a room on an upper floor in the center of the entire building which can not be accessed at all and can not be built up to; you can only access a box in the corner of it by jumping and opening it from a lower floor. the owner stores his things in that box, suicides to respawn inside the unreachable room, then transitions those items to an unreachable box in the room.
@sneakdella: the person who made that base screwed up by not putting pillars in the outer middle sections of the foundations in order to prevent the placement of walls
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They done goofed.
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how grief this
http://i.imgur.com/5x3R0yo.jpg
dont trust only in the doors
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It's big, clunky, and complicated. A large group could easily take it down, and though this base seems doable, it costs an absurd amount of resources and an even more absurd amount of time. Even if you somehow did have the time and patience to get all the resources, there's nothing stopping bandits from destroying it as you build, and in the end, all it takes is a server wipe and griefers/hackers to ruin weeks upon weeks of in-game time, building, and resourcing.
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For the uninitiated, if you read through all the comments here you'll noticed that i acknowledged that it was flawed. You could still build pillars and stairs/walls etc between the outer foundations and get on top. However, with a slight adjustment where you place pillars on EVERY single slot on the two outermost foundation layers, you'll have a base that cannot be accessed through any other means than breaking in at the bottom (stair between 2nd and 3rd floor being the highest you can get)
Edited:
You can't place boxed & barricades taller than one square if the base is built as suggested on one of my replies to this thread. The initial picture i uploaded on the thread is flawed, but i explained it further down in the comments here. There is absolutely nothing to place the barricades or boxes ontop of, thus you can only get in at the 2nd floor as the highest point.
Edited:
It is indeed big, clunky and complicated. However, it is currently the most effective way to defend your loot with no risk involved. Sure you can hide your base and you can make "decoy traps" etc inside the house, but in the end, there is always a risk that the attackers will get lucky with finding your base or making the lucky decisions with their C4. This base is risk-free, and there is absolutely no way what so ever to get inside it.
On a medium-populated server (30-60 during peak times) one can easily farm ~1000 wood per 15 minutes. The base takes ~35,000 wood to get 8 or 9 stories tall, which makes you safe behind 24-28 Metal Doors. 35 x 15 minutes = 525 Minutes. 525 Minutes = 8,75 Hours. That's 8.75 hours of farming for ONE person. If you are building with a couple of friends, it doesn't take long to gather the resources required. Of course there is crafting time and night-time involved which delays the process, but overall this base is extremely efficient and secure, as well as being the most "economical" base in terms of resources spent per unit of safety.
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Sorry about my earlier post, was really rushed for time and was trying to get the whole placing walls and balancing thing down quickly lol
If you're planning on placing that many pillars, I'd recommend staggering the heights on them. If you can balance on a wall, I've no doubt you can stand on a pillar, and I'm sure someone will have figured out how to jump them in a couple of goes.
To prevent people jumping across, have your outermost "row" of pillars as high as possible, the next two rows 1-2 levels lower (to prevent wall placement) , and then raise them again on the 4th row. In this way you're making it as awkward as possible to get on the first pillar, luring the player to the 2nd, and then trapping them with an unreachable 4th. If the pillars are high enough, it's going to be an expensive mistake when they hit the floor again, if they went in unsupported ;)
From side on what you'll end up with is something like this:
(Hope that displays ok for you, as it looks lined up on my system lol)Code:[] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] | | | |
You still consistently never have 2 pillars at the same level, unblocked, and 2 spaces apart for wall/stair placement, but its also nigh on impossible to jump it...
EDIT - Actually, I think I've just figured out how to beat that suggestion... and pretty much any other pillar defence... back to the drawing board for me, lol
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You realise that people can effectively scale your wall just by box/barricade?
You box barricade on the outside of the 1st story wall (yes they can be placed even with pillars), jump up on it, blow the 2nd story wall, then you box barricade on the very edge of that 2nd floor (angled box and barricade), jump up and blow the 3rd story wall. Continue doing this until you hit the floor you desire, then head in.
I have done this to those "unraidable/vault bases", even to a guy in my own group who thought his base was perfect but was completely dumbfounded by how I got in (I replaced the walls on the way back down).
Breaching it is cheap and easy (as long as you know how to platform). This sort of raiding cannot be fixed unless the devs fix where you can put barricades (i.e teetering at an angle on the very edge of something).
This is a better explanation of what semanja was talking about.
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This base can easily be raided using stairs to the top and jumping on the roof, then placing a few sleeping bags on the roof, get 2-3 c4 depending on decay and destroy the top wall while falling down, entry after wall is blown, tada! You can also build a 3rd platform somewhere outside the base, build 2 under the top floor, and build a ramp, then a wood barricade and you should be able to c4 the wall... I've seen it done here somewhere. Also, if you can build a pillar anywhere near the wall, you can pillar barricade up to the top floor easily.
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I genuinely did not know that was possible. Luckily very few out there know of this method, and far less know how to execute it. But i suppose as long as this method is in effect, no base will every be "cheese-safe". The most secure base will have to be a 5x5x10 (10 height) with the loot placed in the middle or so, then just hope they don't guess right. Or perhaps a 10x10x3 monstrocity with the loot placed in a random compartment relatively close to the middle.
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It takes some thinking outside the box, knowledge of game mechanics, and platforming skill but it is the cheapest way to get where you want to go by comparison. I only use it when people build their "unraidable" bases and think they are invincible.
The only reason I thought about it was because I was forced to convert to a vault base when the 5th floor of my 2Lx2Wx20H house got griefed with a ceiling after they realised that there were 2 doors per stairwell so they knocked out the stairs and put in ceilings from 5th to 1st floor.
I sat there for a few hours wondering if it was secure and thought of that. I'm not saying I was the first person to ever think of it as I'm sure there are a few people out there but it took me a few hours to realise my base wasn't secure. Everyone else would come and look at it, think it was unraidable and leave again (rocky area so I had taken all free foundations too).
I don't usually tell people about it because it's not very well known and I didn't want to see it used in every base raid but since I am taking a break from Rust I don't really mind. Hopefully when I come back there are a couple of big content patches and some of the stuff like this has been fixed.
P.S: One thing that can help make this base cost the raiders more. Place boxes/barricades/spike walls/furnaces on the inside of the outer wall. This will absorb some of the damage from C4, making it cost more for them to blow each wall. It goes from needing around 1-2 c4 to multiple (I've seen up to 6-7), it's cheap and effective, and while it won't make it unraidable it will make them use more resources and confuse them.
Good luck man.
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soulfap you can do it like this:
http://i.imgur.com/WCe6DZF.jpg
see im do it in video!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiPUWroo5UQ
forget the 100 doors system with this method you save a lot C4's
Dumb x 3
Agree x 1
Disagree x 1
