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That is, indeed, the typical storage location for shit in the human body. Well, properly speaking, it's the organs connected to the asshole, the asshole is the point of exit, but close enough.
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Just pointing out that there are valid arguments against it besides "ew its a penis"
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Inventory space not being reflected on your NPC is something that's existed with video games since the beginning. Why does eating a mushroom make Mario double in height and then shrink back down the moment something hostile touches him? Why are Doomguy and Quakeguy and basically every other FPS character ever able to run and jump while carrying about 8 weapons and a few thousands of rounds of ammo? And why are they able to effortlessly switch between weapons as if they were carrying them in each hand, even when they switch from a two-handed rocket launcher to a two-handed shotgun?
At some point you have to draw a line at expecting realism to trump gameplay. If you try to explain and justify every single thing in-world, you're going to have a very complex or very boring game.
So, that's one weakly justifiable argument against nudity other than "eww dick". I don't think you're going to win garry over with "it doesn't make sense to be able to store a pistol and 6 clips of ammo with no pockets unless you carry it in your ass".
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I don't want the game to be realistic, i want it to be consistent. It should be based on reality. It is a survival game and giving the player the ability to abuse systems like that is not good. A player being able to have a full arsenal but just because they are naked they arent viewed as a threat. In a survival game you should be able to formalize a plan based of a players appearance. If you see a rifle maybe you should run away. If they have a big backpack they might be worth hunting down. What is in-game prevents this. I do see your point though that it is still a video game, but i feel like it is a feature that just doesnt make sense. You can get naked if you really want to, but it shouldn't be a feature that you can abuse.
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Making the argument for displayable inventory (e.g. a backpack that becomes larger according to how much you have, out of three possible models/sizes, or whatever) is not the same argument as "get rid of nudity".
The two can be, but are not automatically, solved in the same step by making everyone start clothed, but there are other solutions. A backpack, as you suggested, or perhaps a weapon slung over the back.
But that's not an argument against nudity, that's an argument for conveying the threat potential of a player to other players around him. I'm not arguing against that, and I feel it could be a good addition to the game, since you do have naked guys suddenly pulling shotguns out of hammerspace without warning.
But that is, again, not an argument against nudity in the game, unless you want it to be, and then it's a weak argument since it's wholly unnecessary to cover up nudity while still accomplishing the gameplay change.
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It's an argument against how nudity works and how it should be tied to your inventory. I think you should start with tattered cloths so you can have a small inventory then upgrade from there. I just don't like the fact that it doesn't make sense in many ways, it doesn't work with the inventory system, it doesn't make sense logically. You can take off your clothes if you want. I don't want to necessarily want to get rid of nudity even though it does have its benefits, i just want it implemented in a way that makes sense.
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No, it sounds like you want to get rid of nudity. If it isn't the default, it's essentially being gotten rid of except as a way for immature boys to prank their friends by suddenly taking their pants off/toddling the nudity.
Where are the threads calling for a replacement for the rock that's a knife, or some other tool, or requiring a tool to harvest wood, metal, or animal goods? It's hard to skin an animal or get fat off it with a blunt rock that you used to cave its head in. That's not very realistic. Where are the constant threads about that?
Nope, nudity is the one that gets a new thread every 3-4 days because people just can't handle penis pixels. No other "realism" argument gets so much coverage or passion from newer Rust players.
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I do have a thread committed to suggestions to the game at the moment although i dont have one dedicated to getting rid of nudity. I do see your point though, there are bigger issues but i just don't like how people dismiss it so quickly. If changes i think would improve the game gets rid of nudity thats nothing but a side effect.
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You, personally, may have learned the ways of the forum (and postal) enough to not make a nudity thread, and that is why you're still posting
but you and I both know that nudity is far more a frequent topic than basically anything else except hacks/keys/DDOS/clans/whining.
I think that if garry and Pat and Helk and co found themselves at a point in development where they had to choose between keeping nudity in the game, or implementing this really awesome gameplay mechanic that was incompatible with nudity but would make the game tremendously better, the nudity would go out the window with little argument.
But what you're arguing does not force that ultimatum. There is nothing in your argument that requires getting rid of nudity. You are, instead, trying to argue for a change that goes above and beyond what is required and also kicks nudity out, because you have a history of being opposed to the penis for whatever reason. I remember your posting history, Munoz.
I want to make it clear that, at a fundamentally personal level, I respect that some people do not want to look at naked human penis. Don't want to see it, don't look at it. But that doesn't mean that changes have to be made to suit the desires of these people. The devs have made a decision. The only argument with any support that's been made so far (to my knowledge) is "I don't like it", and right now that isn't swaying the devs.
I think if a vast majority of Rust players called for the removal of nudity, it might happen, but it would need to be overwhelming numbers, and those numbers aren't there at this point.
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With that type of attitude nothing would get done in the game. If every change to the game was the result of some ultimatum there would be more progress. Just because the improvement isn't game-changing doesn't mean it is meaningless. I don't care anymore whether it is in the game or not. Although removing would have good effects and no negative effects i don't believe removing it completely is a reasonable request anymore from the community. I just want a game mechanic that would work better than the current one to be considered. I am not some anti-nudity psycho boycotting the game, i am trying to help improve it, and that it all. If you want it in the game the way it is, i respect your opinion. But there are issues with it that aren't deniable.You, personally, may have learned the ways of the forum (and postal) enough to not make a nudity thread, and that is why you're still posting but you and I both know that nudity is far more a frequent topic than basically anything else except hacks/keys/DDOS/clans/whining.
I think that if garry and Pat and Helk and co found themselves at a point in development where they had to choose between keeping nudity in the game, or implementing this really awesome gameplay mechanic that was incompatible with nudity but would make the game tremendously better, the nudity would go out the window with little argument.
But what you're arguing does not force that ultimatum. There is nothing in your argument that requires getting rid of nudity. You are, instead, trying to argue for a change that goes above and beyond what is required and also kicks nudity out, because you have a history of being opposed to the penis for whatever reason. I remember your posting history, Munoz.
I want to make it clear that, at a fundamentally personal level, I respect that some people do not want to look at naked human penis. Don't want to see it, don't look at it. But that doesn't mean that changes have to be made to suit the desires of these people. The devs have made a decision. The only argument with any support that's been made so far (to my knowledge) is "I don't like it", and right now that isn't swaying the devs.
I think if a vast majority of Rust players called for the removal of nudity, it might happen, but it would need to be overwhelming numbers, and those numbers aren't there at this point.
Also, i would appreciate it if you checked out my Community Speaks Thread, you are someone who brings up good arguments and i would like to hear your opinion on it
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Well, actually, Daniel, no, this attitude kind of isn't as insane as you seem to think. Allow me to explain.
Every change made to a piece of software sets up the potential for conflicts and glitches and mistakes, collectively known as bugs. Every change has to be weighed against the risk of it causing more problems. As a result, it is very bad coding practice to just dive headfirst into the problem and start twisting knobs and pulling levers and replacing chunks of code with stuff you wrote off the top of your head. That's how terrible things happen.
No, you're not suggesting that, I'm aware, but that's to illustrate the importance of making sure changes count.
Removing nudity or reskinning the model to cover up the ass and dick, no matter how you phrase it or try and present it, is a change, and it's a change that requires time and effort and carries the risk of causing more bugs in the game.
This change, therefore, has a cost. This cost is development time (which directly translates into money when you get down to it). This cost has to be weighed against the cost of not changing anything.
So far, the cost of not changing nudity is, some youtubers need to be careful in their editing if they are monetizing their channels (not garry's problem), Rust is definitely not going to be deemed suitable by a good portion of the parents of children who want to play it with nudity in the game (this is arguably a plus), threads like this one get created in the forum periodically (a minor nuisance most of the time, and sometimes a source of amusement, so we'll call it even), and lost sales from the previously-mentioned parents and anyone else who is too uncomfortable with the human body to buy a Rust key.
Creative integrity alone is probably worth fifty times the above costs, but I can't speak for garry.
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Im not asking for anything to be removed or changed, simply a mechanic added. I think you are making the process seem much more complicated than the reality. These are professionals after all, and this is an alpha. Bugs are expected if any even come up. You are also making light of the issues. We are obviously never going to agree on this topic. You think its more trouble than its worth to take it out and i think its more trouble than its worth to leave it in.
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scares me more when they walk up to your fire at night and have just the head-wrap and hand-cannon....i most certainly run like hell
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Convenient how mechanics changes all seem to revolve around removing nudity. How about, when you're naked, you can only carry a maximum of two things? There, there's your realism solution.
I don't see a reason to take it out, and your arguments have been unconvincing, at least to me. Change for the sake of change in coding is a bad habit.
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That is obviously impractical. How can a system where your inventory is based on what you have equipped co-exist with the current system. It can't. It is not change for the sake of change, i already told you the reason behind having that system in place. Dying because someone took off their clothes is an option that is often abused.
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So why does visible inventory require a near-complete load of clothing? If you've got a shotgun or M4 or something, have it slung over the back of your model if it's not equipped. If you've got more than 2-3 things in your inventory, have a rucksack on the character's back. As more things get thrown into the inventory, it becomes a larger backpack proportionally.
That doesn't require clothing, and still conveys an impression of inventory and combat readiness.
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No i completely agree there, I was hoping they would add a primary and secondary weapon slot or something along those lines because of the same reason you just said. The only question is how would you spawn? Naked and with a backpack? It would just all work if you simply spawned with torn up clothes as if your character has already been surviving. If you could come up with an alternative i would be more than willing to hear it.
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I am so glad that the devs put dicks in this game. Whenever I am sad, or depressed, I just come to the rust subforum and watch little kids whine about dicks in a game that is in no way made for them.
I have made a flow chart on the subject:
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that's stupid. the game isnt at all about dicks and definitely aren't the deciding factor in whether the game is for you or not.I am so glad that the devs put dicks in this game. Whenever I am sad, or depressed, I just come to the rust subforum and watch little kids whine about dicks in a game that is in no way made for them.
I have made a flow chart on the subject:
I find the nudity pretty hilarious at times but that doesn't mean I wouldn't like something to help people cover their dicks up faster.
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Make/wear pants or embrace the dick.
Is this logic really so hard to follow? Garry's made it pretty clear he's not changing nudity.
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this isnt a black and white thing. I never said I was against nudity, I just think it should be easier for day ones to cover there shame. I don't really see the opposition to that, i'm not asking for anything major to be removed or changed. Plus loin cloths look cool, I could go conan the barbarian on some mother fuckers
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The nudity is important for the gameplay... Let's all start todays rape-game.
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Am I the only one who personally thinks the dick ratio is too low in the game? Rather than a craft-able loincloth, give me a craft-able strap-on I can slap somewhere to fulfill the dick quota
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Meant to agree fuckin tablets
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Maybe give the animals dicks? like big floppy ones that drag a long the ground when you chase them
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Why aren't you in the dev team? Brilliant idea +1 Garry you must hire this guy
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Need some good cock physics first.
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I hear Batman from US Central by PlayRust.EU has a tiny dick. They could bring him in to the studio for a few bucks and get some accurate cock physics off him...
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I am not sure where people are getting this, "nudity is wrong" idea at. I feel like it is up to personal morals, I also say if you don't like seeing it, maybe you should either craft some pants for your fellow players or stop playing the game. This game is about survival and we have people killing each other for no reason, I don't see how that is okay and totally moral but yet nudity is so extremely wrong, I feel like the people who are against it are completely insecure with their sexuality. I, myself, don't even see the wangs when I see a naked player, I don't understand why some of you are staring at it.
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At the risk of firing this up again, I would like to point out that this isn't a debate about whether it is MORAL to BE nude versus the MORALITY of ACTUALLY killing people.
This is a straw man that continues to be perpetuated.
Simulated violence is not morally wrong and/or doesn't offend sensibilities to the same degree as SEEING someone nude in a game. YOU might not be offended, but that doesn't change the fact that game ratings would rank 'people running around in a game naked' worse than 'people running around shooting each other', especially in these early stages where the violence isn't even that realistic (no blood splatter, no impact response to those being hit, etc.). The ratings, while probably overly sensitive, do reflect society's norms in general more than the average Facepunch player/forum poster's norms.
This is the debate. Yes, killing someone is worse than being nude. No one debates that fact.
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I still don't care. The game will be rated Mature if ESRB ever gets a hold of it, I doubt they ever will, but who cares, it keeps the young'ns out of the game because the parents don't want the kid looking at wangs all day. I could care less, you are naked for what, 10 minutes, it isn't difficult to craft pants ya know.
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It isn't about BEING naked, it's about SEEING other people naked, which is something you can't really do anything about (besides not playing, obviously).
I don't believe that it keeps young'n's out because I don't believe the average young'n's parents are involved enough to actually evaluate what their kids are playing, but that is a whole other discussion.
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If you aren't comfortable with your sexuality enough to see a fake 3D model naked man, than you might be gay man. I don't even notice the dong anymore.
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I've always thought that modern western culture was generally a bit too stuck up about nudity/sex in its media so when I see any form of media just give those "sensibilities" the finger like this game does, I can't help but find it amusing and hope to see more. It just seems like such a contradiction to me that so many people see nudity and engage in sexual activity in the real world but it's considered somehow wrong to have it in any form of media.
I mean, i'm not a big fan of sexual humor (I find it's too easy and 90% of the time isn't really funny) but a little nudity in a game that isn't even referenced sexually in ANY way is completely harmless to me. Nude does not equal sexual. It's simply the natural state of being for a human.
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I agree. Unfortunately as a parent, I have pressure on me to conform to norms I may not even agree with because society as a whole, or at least the local society, does, and it's easier to conform than to 'buck the system' for something that really doesn't matter. If my son was old enough and mature enough to understand the issue, then it wouldn't be a big deal.
I guess my only thing is that I don't personally believe that the 'shock value' or 'immersion' factor of having the players be completely nude is worth the limit the nudity puts on the game in terms of player numbers or exposure (pun intended) that can be made in public media. I also understand that Garry has his own goals that don't necessarily coincide with those things.
Edited:
You REALLY don't understand the argument. Your gay comment is also unwarranted and shows a lack of understanding of sexuality.
I am not offended by the 'dong'.
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Well, I don't remember if you said what age your son is but you might be surprised how mature a child can be in relation to these kinds of issues if you just give them the chance. They can often prove more mature than adults simply because they don't have decades of experience leading them in the wrong direction like many adults do.
That being said, not exposing your child to certain forms of media you don't think they're ready for yet is a part of parenting. You can't expect to change that media to suit your needs, you just have to work around it.
I'd be inclined to agree on this point for the simple reason that things like Youtube coverage tends to drastically boost the popularity of games and their sales along with it. The nudity in this game (while seemingly accepted by both Youtube and Twitch since both have a decent amount of video on it) seems to put people off the idea of covering it on their channel. This could work against Gary in the long run by reducing the amount of free advertising he could have received from these sources that indie companies like his usually rely upon.
That being said, it's his choice to make and I think it's a good one. It might hurt sales but I tend to feel that a game should be designed in whatever way best fits that game's concept rather than to ensure the largest number of sales. That way of thinking generally leads to better overall games, even if they do end up with some annoying or unpopular aspects to them.
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No one is running around in the game naked - its simulated by an avatar - as is the murders of innocent animals and people.
So everything is moot - lock the thread - the answer is 42.
Edit: Literally - I never notice anyones penis unless I am throwing pants @ them because they are THAT close to me.
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8th November 2013 Last edited by frozensoda; 8th November 2013 at 10:33PM. (why am I arguing with these people)
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