1. Post #1
    Zambies!'s Avatar
    August 2009
    8,129 Posts
    http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/11/26/15458995-minnesota-man-who-killed-teens-in-break-in-charged-with-murder posted:
    Minnesota man who killed teens in break-in charged with murder
    By NBC News staff and wire services
    A 64-year-old Minnesota man was charged Monday with murder for killing two teenagers who he said broke into his Little Falls home, shooting them in the head, the Minneapolis Star Tribune reported .

    AP file
    Byron David Smith was arrested after he told police he shot and killed two teenagers who he said were breaking into his home on Thanksgiving Day.

    "If you're trying to shoot somebody and they laugh at you, you go again," Byron David Smith of Little Falls told investigators, according to a criminal complaint filed Monday.
    Smith was charged with two counts of second-degree murder in the deaths of Haile Kifer, 18, and her cousin, Nicholas Brady, 17, both of Little Falls. The teens were shot on Thanksgiving Day, but their deaths weren't reported until Friday.
    Brady has also used the name Schaeffel, which is his mother’s maiden name, at times for family reasons, according to the sheriff's office.
    In the criminal complaint, Smith said he was in the basement of his remote home about 10 miles southwest of Little Falls when he heard a window breaking upstairs, followed by footsteps that eventually approached the basement stairwell. Fearful after several break-ins, according to the complaint, Smith said he fired when Brady came into view from the waist down.
    After the teen fell down the stairs, Smith said he shot him in the face as he lay on the floor.
    "I want him dead," the complaint quoted Smith telling an investigator.
    Smith said he dragged Brady's body into his basement workshop, then sat back down on his chair, and after a few minutes Kifer began coming down the stairs. He said he shot her as soon as her hips appeared, and she fell down the steps.
    Smith said he tried to shoot her again with his Mini 14 rifle, but that the gun jammed and Kifer laughed at him.
    "Smith stated that it was not a very long laugh because she was already hurting," according to the complaint.
    Smith said he then shot Kifer in the chest several times with a .22-caliber revolver, dragged her next to Brady, and with her still gasping for air, fired a shot under her chin "up into the cranium."
    "Smith described it as 'a good clean finishing shot,'" according to the compliant, but also that he acknowledged he had fired "more shots than (he) needed to."
    The following day he asked a neighbor to recommend a good lawyer, according to the complaint. He later asked his neighbor to call the police.
    A prosecutor called Smith's reaction "appalling."
    "Mr. Smith intentionally killed two teenagers in his home in a matter that goes well beyond self-defense," Morrison County Attorney Brian Middendorf said after Smith appeared at Morrison County District Court on Monday morning. Bail was set at $2 million.

    Minnesota law allows a homeowner to use deadly force on an intruder if a reasonable person would fear they're in danger of harm. Smith told investigators he was afraid the intruders might have a weapon.
    Smith's actions "sound like an execution" rather than legitimate self-defense, said David Pecchia, executive director of the Minnesota Chiefs of Police Association. Pecchia said his statements to investigators suggest he had eliminated any threat to his safety by wounding the cousins.
    Smith's brother, Bruce Smith, told the Star Tribune of Minneapolis that the incident was the eighth burglary at Byron Smith's home in recent years.
    The only report the Morrison County sheriff's office has for a break-in at the home was for one on Oct. 27. It shows Byron Smith reported losing cash and gold coins worth $9,200, plus two guns worth $200 each, photo equipment worth more than $3,000 and a ring worth $300.
    Little Falls is about 100 miles northwest of Minneapolis.
    Brady's sister, Crystal Schaeffel, told the Star Tribune that Kifer had broken into her home before. Little Falls police records show Crystal Schaeffel reported a theft Aug. 28, but the department said the report was not public because that investigation was continuing and because it named juveniles.
    Tessa Ruth, an aunt of Brady, attended Smith's hearing. She told the Star Tribune she wished the man had fired a warning shot or alerted the police instead of shooting the teens.
    "It wasn't right for them to be there and, yes, he had a right to defend himself. But to execute them like that..."
    A Facebook page was created to commemorate the teens.
    Edited:

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  2. Post #2
    It's time to unban Banshee Friend
    Dennab
    April 2011
    5,915 Posts
    I don't know where I stand on this, shooting teenagers is never a good idea if you don't want to spend time in jail, but it looks like the second kid was asking for it. You don't get shot at and then laugh the person who just missed. Chances are it was a bad shot, and most people I know with guns don't just keep one bullet in the chamber.
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  3. Post #3
    Zambies!'s Avatar
    August 2009
    8,129 Posts
    They were probably drunk, and there was an execution shot.
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  4. Post #4
    Gordy H.'s Avatar
    April 2010
    1,206 Posts
    Executing two unarmed(?) people, regardless of their age, is unacceptable. He should be charged with manslaughter at the absolute least.
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  5. Post #5
    Dennab
    October 2010
    2,030 Posts
    I don't care how bad they were, if you do an execution shot, you dun goofed
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  6. Post #6
    Gold Member

    May 2007
    1,013 Posts
    Well that's capital murder. I hope he enjoys being in jail for the rest of his life.
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  7. Post #7
    caw caw motherfuckers
    rilez's Avatar
    July 2007
    7,849 Posts
    He admitted to executing them both.

    This isn't self defense. He's guilty as all hell.
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  8. Post #8
    Dennab
    September 2011
    3,417 Posts
    I don't know where I stand on this, shooting teenagers is never a good idea if you don't want to spend time in jail, but it looks like the second kid was asking for it. You don't get shot at and then laugh the person who just missed. Chances are it was a bad shot, and most people I know with guns don't just keep one bullet in the chamber.
    There's whole lot of wrong on both sides so it's best to just stay neutral on this.
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  9. Post #9
    Gold Member
    A_Pigeon's Avatar
    November 2011
    3,312 Posts
    Why does that guy have no pupils?
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  10. Post #10
    caw caw motherfuckers
    rilez's Avatar
    July 2007
    7,849 Posts
    There's whole lot of wrong on both sides so it's best to just stay neutral on this.
    What did two unarmed teenagers do to deserve being shot multiple times? What reason did he have to fear for his own life?

    Yeah, they shouldn't have broken into his home, but they shouldn't have been killed for it either.
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  11. Post #11
    ಥ益ಥ ... Beautiful.
    Kill001's Avatar
    April 2006
    11,874 Posts
    At first I started reading that the teens broke into the house and then the homeowner does this

    Smith said he fired when Brady came into view from the waist down.
    After the teen fell down the stairs, Smith said he shot him in the face as he lay on the floor.
    "I want him dead," the complaint quoted Smith telling an investigator...
    Smith said he dragged Brady's body into his basement workshop, then sat back down on his chair, and after a few minutes Kifer began coming down the stairs. He said he shot her as soon as her hips appeared, and she fell down the steps.
    Smith said he tried to shoot her again with his Mini 14 rifle, but that the gun jammed and Kifer laughed at him.
    "Smith stated that it was not a very long laugh because she was already hurting," according to the complaint.
    Smith said he then shot Kifer in the chest several times with a .22-caliber revolver, dragged her next to Brady, and with her still gasping for air, fired a shot under her chin "up into the cranium."
    As much as I'd be pissed if someone kept breaking into my house, that seems excessive for a case of 'home defense'
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  12. Post #12
    Dennab
    September 2011
    3,417 Posts
    What did two unarmed teenagers do to deserve being shot multiple times? What reason did he have to fear for his own life?

    Yeah, they shouldn't have broken into his home, but they shouldn't have been killed for it either.
    They broke into house, other went down the basement, got shot, and the other one's common sense failed and went down there too. Got shot but survived, and of all the possibilities she chose to laught at her shooter.

    I don't know, this is like somesort of culmination of bad decicions from both sides.
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  13. Post #13
    erryday i'm hustlin
    Keeshond v2's Avatar
    April 2010
    1,032 Posts
    That's fucked up. I can understand using a gun for home defence but I don't think I could pull the trigger on someone unarmed unless they were actively trying to attack me, and even then I'd aim to maim, not kill, unless close quarters gave me no other choice.

    These were someones kids..

  14. Post #14
    Dennab
    June 2011
    2,108 Posts
    He was in the clear until he started moving bodies around and executing them on the floor
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  15. Post #15
    sedarahC's Avatar
    November 2007
    240 Posts
    This is why blind people shouldn't be allowed guns.
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  16. Post #16
    This probably isn't a good idea
    Camundongo's Avatar
    October 2007
    3,362 Posts
    This guy sounds really, really messed up in the head.
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  17. Post #17
    caw caw motherfuckers
    rilez's Avatar
    July 2007
    7,849 Posts
    They broke into house, other went down the basement, got shot, and the other one's common sense failed and went down there too. Got shot but survived, and of all the possibilities she chose to laught at her shooter.

    I don't know, this is like somesort of culmination of bad decicions from both sides.
    Breaking into someone's house is a bad idea. A stupid idea. But to say the issue is "neutral" when you have some wacko who murdered two unarmed kids is crazy.

    Also, what does laughing at the guy have to do with it? Her cousin is dead, and she's already been shot at that point. What should she have done? Begged for mercy?

    The guy wanted them dead because he wanted them dead. He pulled them aside when they were no danger to him, and made sure they were dead. It doesn't matter what the kids did. They didn't deserve that.
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  18. Post #18
    Gold Member
    Sleepy Head's Avatar
    August 2006
    2,451 Posts
    Smith said he then shot Kifer in the chest several times with a .22-caliber revolver, dragged her next to Brady, and with her still gasping for air, fired a shot under her chin "up into the cranium."
    fucking gruesome, this is like a scene straight from a movie. there is no justification for that.

    I hope justice is served properly here, and that this dude gets some serious help.
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  19. Post #19
    Voted WORST Gold Member 2012
    Killuah's Avatar
    August 2005
    15,111 Posts
    We don't k ow for sure if she laughed. He was wacko enough to shoot someone with an executing shot, for all we know everything he tells but the facts could be BS and the facts are: Unarmed, executing shot.
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  20. Post #20
    Gold Member
    Number-41's Avatar
    August 2005
    4,246 Posts
    I don't know shit about law, but why did he get a 2M$ bail? Does that mean he walks if he/someone coughs up that money ? I just read on wikipedia that

    18 U.S.C. § 3142(f) provides that only persons who fit into certain categories are subject to detention without bail: persons charged with a crime of violence, an offense for which the maximum sentence is life imprisonment or death, certain drug offenses for which the maximum offense is greater than 10 years, repeat felony offenders, or if the defendant poses a serious risk of flight, obstruction of justice, or witness tampering. There is a special hearing held to determine whether the defendant fits within these categories; anyone not within them must be admitted to bail.
    Seems to me that a guy who cold-bloodedly executes two people fits right in there.

    Edit:

    just read up on it, and it's not a get-out-of jail free card, though it still seems absurd to me that law makes a distinction between rich and poor people (naive me I guess)

  21. Post #21
    Gold Member
    HumanAbyss's Avatar
    March 2009
    17,289 Posts
    There's whole lot of wrong on both sides so it's best to just stay neutral on this.
    Breaking in is wrong. No fucking duh

    That doesn't mean it's "equally" wrong to fucking executing two people.

    Like how do you even think those are fucking equivalent?
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  22. Post #22
    Dennab
    September 2011
    3,417 Posts
    Breaking into someone's house is a bad idea. A stupid idea. But to say the issue is "neutral" when you have some wacko who murdered two unarmed kids is crazy.

    Also, what does laughing at the guy have to do with it? Her cousin is dead, and she's already been shot at that point. What should she have done? Begged for mercy?

    The guy wanted them dead because he wanted them dead. He pulled them aside when they were no danger to him, and made sure they were dead. It doesn't matter what the kids did. They didn't deserve that.
    I never said the issue was neutral, just that it's better to stay neutral on the subject instead of taking sides. Don't twist my words.

    And what do you know what effect it could have had on the man if she started crying and begging for mercy?

    We could keep on with what ifs and at the end of the day we wouldn't be none the wiser.

    Breaking in is wrong. No fucking duh

    That doesn't mean it's "equally" wrong to fucking executing two people.

    Like how do you even think those are fucking equivalent?
    I didn't mean anything by it people stop taking steam about it you nutjobs
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  23. Post #23
    Voted WORST Gold Member 2012
    Killuah's Avatar
    August 2005
    15,111 Posts
    I never said the issue was neutral, just that it's better to stay neutral on the subject instead of taking sides. Don't twist my words.

    And what do you know what effect it could have had on the man if she started crying and begging for mercy?
    For all we know she could've done that.

  24. Post #24
    Gold Member
    HumanAbyss's Avatar
    March 2009
    17,289 Posts
    I never said the issue was neutral, just that it's better to stay neutral on the subject instead of taking sides. Don't twist my words.

    And what do you know what effect it could have had on the man if she started crying and begging for mercy?

    We could keep on with what ifs and at the end of the day we wouldn't be none the wiser.
    You said
    There's whole lot of wrong on both sides so it's best to just stay neutral on this.
    Remaining neutral on the execution of two people for breaking and entering? Like, seriously? I get defending your home with serious force, but that's NOT what happened here.

    dumb me all you want smeisgester, just shows you have no argument about what you're saying.
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  25. Post #25
    Gold Member
    Dennab
    November 2006
    6,827 Posts
    Defending himself would have been justifiable.

    Executing unarmed people, and not allowing police to apprehend them properly when they arrive?

    Deserves his sentence.

  26. Post #26
    This probably isn't a good idea
    Camundongo's Avatar
    October 2007
    3,362 Posts
    I never said the issue was neutral, just that it's better to stay neutral on the subject instead of taking sides. Don't twist my words.
    The guy admitted to executing two teenage intruders who (as far as I can tell from the article) were unarmed, and asked his neighbour if he knew a good lawyer before asking him to report it all to the police a day later.

    This isn't a grey vs grey issue, this man is so far in the wrong it's almost unreal.
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  27. Post #27
    Facepunch Babysitter
    BANNED USER's Avatar
    July 2009
    12,252 Posts
    The dude is a shit bag no doubt, execution shots are never warranted. But one thing sticks out at me.

    Kifer had broken into her home before. Little Falls police records show Crystal Schaeffel reported a theft Aug. 28, but the department said the report was not public because that investigation was continuing and because it named juveniles.
    Why the hell did this kid decide it was a good idea to break in again after getting caught once and probably doing it multiple times before? Clearly all parties involved made bad mistakes. Not ones that warrant death that is clear and apparent, but this guy snapped due to repeat break-ins. It could have been anyone else who broke in who would have suffered the same fate.
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  28. Post #28
    Wootmang's Avatar
    June 2009
    174 Posts
    Those teens broke the law in the first place, had they not been there this wouldn't even be an issue. If someone tried to break into my house i'd do the same, regardless of age. Who really has the time to sit there and determine an intruders age in the moment???? Some people look younger or older than they really are anyways. Plus he had no idea if they had a gun or not...Any way the cookie crumbles, these teens got what was coming to them since they ultimately made the decision to break the law in the first place. This is why you shouldn't break into peoples homes.
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  29. Post #29
    Gold Member
    FreakyMe's Avatar
    December 2005
    4,916 Posts
    They broke into house, other went down the basement, got shot, and the other one's common sense failed and went down there too. Got shot but survived, and of all the possibilities she chose to laught at her shooter.

    I don't know, this is like somesort of culmination of bad decicions from both sides.
    If I were in a situation like that where I was surely going to die, I would hope that I could muster the strength to laugh until my last breath.

    Why not? You're dying.
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  30. Post #30
    Gold Member
    Boxbot219's Avatar
    September 2005
    2,266 Posts
    Those teens broke the law in the first place, had they not been there this wouldn't even be an issue. If someone tried to break into my house i'd do the same, regardless of age. Who really has the time to sit there and determine an intruders age in the moment???? Some people look younger or older than they really are anyways. Plus he had no idea if they had a gun or not...Any way the cookie crumbles, these teens got what was coming to them since they ultimately made the decision to break the law in the first place. This is why you shouldn't break into peoples homes.
    You would execute someone who is no longer a threat after you shot them?

    People like you shouldn't be allowed to have guns.
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  31. Post #31
    Gordy H.'s Avatar
    April 2010
    1,206 Posts
    I don't know shit about law, but why did he get a 2M$ bail? Does that mean he walks if he/someone coughs up that money ? I just read on wikipedia that



    Seems to me that a guy who cold-bloodedly executes two people fits right in there.

    Edit:

    just read up on it, and it's not a get-out-of jail free card, though it still seems absurd to me that law makes a distinction between rich and poor people (naive me I guess)
    Paying your bail means you can leave jail until your trial. There's no distinction between rich and poor as far as I'm aware, your bail amount is typically set at what seems suitable for your crimes. For example, armed robbery could only be a few thousand whereas capital murder can go into the tens of millions.
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  32. Post #32
    caw caw motherfuckers
    rilez's Avatar
    July 2007
    7,849 Posts
    Those teens broke the law in the first place, had they not been there this wouldn't even be an issue. If someone tried to break into my house i'd do the same, regardless of age. Who really has the time to sit there and determine an intruders age in the moment???? Some people look younger or older than they really are anyways. Plus he had no idea if they had a gun or not...Any way the cookie crumbles, these teens got what was coming to them since they ultimately made the decision to break the law in the first place. This is why you shouldn't break into peoples homes.
    He had the right to defend himself. Not to execute them well after there was any possible threat to himself.

    I find it interesting, though, that you're so willing to admit you would murder two teenagers. Says a lot about you, dude.
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  33. Post #33
    Gordy H.'s Avatar
    April 2010
    1,206 Posts
    Those teens broke the law in the first place, had they not been there this wouldn't even be an issue. If someone tried to break into my house i'd do the same, regardless of age. Who really has the time to sit there and determine an intruders age in the moment???? Some people look younger or older than they really are anyways. Plus he had no idea if they had a gun or not...Any way the cookie crumbles, these teens got what was coming to them since they ultimately made the decision to break the law in the first place. This is why you shouldn't break into peoples homes.
    Executing an unarmed, wounded person over a burglary. I hope you're never in any position of power, christ.
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  34. Post #34
    racerfan's Avatar
    January 2012
    1,826 Posts
    I don't know where I stand on this.

    He was defending himself from some intruders, but it looks like he essentially executed them. He could have just called the police after he shot them once. It wouldn't make sense to try to aim for a kill (unless they were armed, but they weren't), and executing them was a cruel move.
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  35. Post #35
    Facepunch armorer
    OrionChronicles's Avatar
    February 2010
    3,978 Posts
    If someone breaks into your house you shoot them. If they are still alive and not fighting back after the first shot, you keep them alive until the police arrive. Grumpy old fucktard overstepped his bounds.
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  36. Post #36
    Gold Member
    Mr Flexi's Avatar
    January 2010
    3,511 Posts
    I'm glad that they aren't just ruling this a self-defence and letting him go free.
    There needs to be boundaries when it comes to this.

  37. Post #37
    Gold Member

    March 2005
    4,249 Posts
    He sounds like he's psychopathic honestly. I'm arguably drawing some thin lines here but I'd even guess he knew very well he was in no danger as he'd already caught one of them before.

    He had no justification for unloading a revolver into one's chest and executing them both.
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  38. Post #38

    June 2011
    270 Posts
    He did shoot more than he should have with the second person, but what he did wasn't wrong. If you saw a human dying, and you know he/she isn't going to make it, would you euthanise the person? Or let them die in agony? How else are you supposed to feel if you live out of town and someone breaks in?(especially if there's been several break ins, someone's out to get you) How long would it take for the police/ambulance to arrive if you live out on a private property?
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  39. Post #39
    Gold Member
    cecilbdemodded's Avatar
    January 2005
    6,294 Posts
    The teenagers were scumbag thieves who deserved to die, but this guy is deliberately begging to be convicted for their murders. He could have easily killed them and NOT give incriminating statements to the police.

    So, in my opinion, this is one of those rare cases where the criminals(teens) chose the wrong house to rob(an insane armed guy's house). Win/win in my opinion, all the criminals will be dead or in prison when this case is over.
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  40. Post #40
    there was an issue where three (16 year old) kids physically assualted an old man and 1 died 1 was injured and 1 was jailed, I agreed it was fair use of a gun.

    This is different though. This man is a psycho. Who the hell pulls a execution shot anyways.

    The teenagers were scumbag thieves who deserved to die, but this guy is deliberately begging to be convicted for their murders. He could have easily killed them and NOT give incriminating statements to the police.

    So, in my opinion, this is one of those rare cases where the criminals(teens) chose the wrong house to rob(an insane armed guy's house). Win/win in my opinion, all the criminals will be dead or in prison when this case is over.
    You are pretty messed up. I must say.

    Because of how fucked up you are, I think you deserve to be permabanned and then hit by a bus. and live to tell about the ban.

    That logic doesn't sound nice when it's pointed towards you does it?

    Those teens broke the law in the first place, had they not been there this wouldn't even be an issue. If someone tried to break into my house i'd do the same, regardless of age. Who really has the time to sit there and determine an intruders age in the moment???? Some people look younger or older than they really are anyways. Plus he had no idea if they had a gun or not...Any way the cookie crumbles, these teens got what was coming to them since they ultimately made the decision to break the law in the first place. This is why you shouldn't break into peoples homes.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisoc...ality_disorder
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